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Geek Culture / Nasty virus?

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 19:42 Edited at: 21st Nov 2006 19:48
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The last couple of days have been HELL!

I was working on my animation addon for DBpro on Friday night. I put my notebook in hibernate and went to bed. Everything was fine.
On Saturday morning, I woke up and went to check my e-mail. I took my computer out of hibernate and there were all kinds of artifacts on the screen. So, I simply rebooted - or, at least tried to.

The computer restarted and BEFORE windows started, at the HP screen where you can choose to go into the BIOS there were vertical lines all down my screen. The boot continued until just before the logon screen (the vertical lines were still there), then POOF! Power off and reboot. This could continue forever if I left it go. So, I booted in safe mode. No problem (excepth the vertical lines).

At thsi point, it seemed to SURELY be a problem with my video card, motherboard, and/or power supply. I called HP and they agreed. They are sending me materials to ship my notebook to them.

Before I ship my notebook off, I wanted to get an image of the drive. So, I did the sensible thing. I brought my notebook to work with me, took the hard drive out and put it into my work PC. I could then easily to an image, right? Nope. hahaha <-(but it's a fake laugh).
My work PC started to boot. In fact, it booted all of the way. I then had to do something else (I was at WORK afterall), so I took the hard drive back out and rebooted - or at least tried. NOW MY DAMN WORK PC WON"T BOOT EITHER!
There are differences though. My work PC has no graphical problems.

Because of this, I began to *slightly* suspect a virus. I do keep my virus protection very much up to date though and nothing has ever got through before....

Last night, I tried booting my laptop in VGA mode (which I had tried before and it didn't work). For SOME unknow reason, it worked. In VGA mode, it gives you the option to change graphics modes. I tried that and as soon as I do - POOF! Computer drops dead and starts rebooting. So, it must be a hardware problem right? In the VGA mode I still have the vertical lines....

Well, for kicks, I decided to try a full virus scan. Since I was now able to get into my notebook in VGA mode (and it started all processes), I was able to do an update to my virus protection. I started the scan afterward and FOUR viruses were found! Still, I had the vertical lines on my screen though (even at boot) so maybe I had a virus problem AND a hardware problem???
After I did the full virus scan, I did a reboot, then ANOTHER full virus scan. This time it found nothing. Well, I still needed to send the notebook in so I still needed to do an image of the drive. So, I started to clean of a lot of old apps that I don't use anymore. One of the apps wanted me to reboot after uninstalling. So I did, again in VGA mode. After working for a few more minutes, I noticed the vertical lines were GONE! So, I did a reboot in normal mode and the notebook came back up like nothing ever happened to it!

So now, I am lost!
There are too many cooincidental things that don't add up! I KNOW I had a virus. But, how could the virus effect the graphics of the screen at boot if it didn't somehow flash my BIOS? And I am SURE Symantec didn't flash it back if that had happened. So how could the problem go away from removing a virus?

By the way, my work PC is still fried. It will NOT boot in VGA mode. Virus scans also will not complete. I think something took an axe to the registry. Only one symtem is the same - it won't boot correctly. Nothing else is similar. If it got the virus from my notebook hard drive, shouldn't the symptoms and solutions be similar?

Any ideas? I am about to just FDISK it and start over

Ugggggg! I really hate computer sometimes.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 19:58
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What antivirus do you use? I've used a whole array of them and they all tend to catch different things - I currently use Antivir (from www.free-av.com) as its found a couple of minor ones that all the others missed.

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 20:15
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Since I use my laptop at work too, the office provides me a copy of Symantec Antivirus.

I just don't understand how a virus could effect your computer on boot even before the BIOS screen is available. If it did, wouldn't it have to flash your BIOS? If that happened, Symantec Antivirus wouldn't have fixed it! But if it wasn't a virus, then how did the problem go away when the virus was cleared?

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TKF15H
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 21:34
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Quote: "I just don't understand how a virus could effect your computer on boot even before the BIOS screen is available. If it did, wouldn't it have to flash your BIOS?"

Way back in the DOS days I heard something about viruses that could survive a soft reboot. Dunno if any actually exist or if anything like that would still work today. It doesn't sound like it was a virus behind it though, more like a motherboard fault and a set of suspicious coincidences.

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PowerSoft
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 21:58
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Finite Improbability Drives....

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BatVink
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 22:42
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I just want to be a fly on the wall when you say to your boss "I had a virus on my home laptop, so I put the drive in my works PC and lost everything". I know it's not at all funny, but it could be a Dilbert cartoon strip.

But to answer your question, it's a weird one. You have so many things happening, it's hard to know which is the cause and what is just a red herring.



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Kentaree
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Posted: 21st Nov 2006 22:56
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I'd check it with another AV than Norton, which in my experience is a POS. Use AVG if you're looking for something free, or Nod32 if you dont mind paying

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indi
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 02:19
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it could of been a combination of virus and bios load error and or faulty video driver.
trend micro house call can be a great online checker if you get that far.
time to setup a raid with backup in mind, I think, or incremental backups daily.

putting that drive into the work pc gave me shudders as well.

Some Design houses Ive worked at have praised me for setting up a dummy node they can break, it may cost a little but it pays off in the long run. Basically a PC that can be ruined, is not on the direct LAN with access to the internet through a wireless router in front of the firewall so its traffic is not connected to the LAN in the office.

The bash box at Yamaha Australia is an old AMD and its saves two issues already.

A Bash Box can also act as a dummy user to your system, akin to the worst user experience you can setup for a website etc..

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 02:23
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Quote: "I just want to be a fly on the wall when you say to your boss "I had a virus on my home laptop, so I put the drive in my works PC and lost everything". I know it's not at all funny, but it could be a Dilbert cartoon strip."


lol
Luckily, I do our IT work, so the only person to go to with the problem is myself. Although, since there was only four days left, on my laptop warranty, the IT department was nice enough to extend it for me since I DO use the laptop for work purposes too

Quote: "I'd check it with another AV than Norton, which in my experience is a POS."


I think there is a difference between "Norton" antivirus and "Symantec" antivirus. Norton is more for home use and Symantec is more for business. Symantec actually has done a very good job for us up until this point.

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Phaelax
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 06:42
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Norton has probably the best detection of any AV software out there. The problem is, its just detection! It tells you there's a virus but it doesn't know how to get rid of it.

Quote: "Finite Improbability Drives...."

hahaha, wonder if anyone else got that?



I remember hearing of a virus years and years ago that could install into the boot sector of your drive. Like TK, I've never seen it nor known if this was a fact or not.

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jasonhtml
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 07:02
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but the plugins alright, right?


Thread: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=78971&b=8&p=0
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Dextro
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 07:10
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In the old days (16-bit era) there were com puter viruses that could store themselves on the boot sector of the hard disk, opr even floppies, but since the 32-bit era started, motherboards have some ways to check all that stuff and prevent viruses hooking the boot sector.
But, I remember 5 or 6 years ago, someone wrote a virus that stored itself in the BIOS.
Maybe you got some virus that stores itself onto the BIOS, and scrambles video settings. Maybe it's the same virus im talking about, which most antiviruses (including Trend, Norton, and MCafee)
don't detect in a windows enviroment.
here i provide a link to page that describes that kind of viruses.
Maybe you should make backup copies of your software, and reformat your drive, then install an aplication that detects any file size change. If after installing your old software the app detects that certain driver or .exe increases in size, you should send it to Nortno, or symantec, or whatever.
Here's the link:
http://www.fireav.com/virusinfo/library/kriz.htm
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indi
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 07:32
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Quote: "Norton has probably the best detection of any AV software out there"


Norton used to be the apple pie in the 80's/90's.

I dont like it anymore because its serious BLOATWARE.

John MCafee 's products would be better hands down without even a butt scratch.

Norton have grown so large and trying to add too much, they forget that the intended purpose should be light weight.

Most rating posts regarding AV software dont even mention Nortons if that gives you an indication.
http://antivirus.about.com/cs/beforeyoubuy/tp/aatpavwin.htm

I still use AVG on all my clients machines, Nod32 looks like i will move them over soon.

Then again if you are serious about developing something that doesnt require DirectX, you would choose another OS, just for the sheer virri amounts alone is an indication how bad windows manages it.

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 11:21
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As I said, I think there is a big difference between the Norton product and the Symantec product, even though they are owned by the same company.
This is what I use:
http://www.symantec.com/enterprise/products/overview.jsp?pcid=1322&pvid=805_1

Quote: "Quote: "Finite Improbability Drives...."
hahaha, wonder if anyone else got that?"

I'm afraid that I did not.

Quote: "but the plugins alright, right?"

The plugins are all safe. I do regular data backups. I just don't want to re-install (and find) all of my applications.

Quote: "In the old days (16-bit era) there were com puter viruses that could store themselves on the boot sector of the hard disk, opr even floppies, but since the 32-bit era started, motherboards have some ways to check all that stuff and prevent viruses hooking the boot sector.
But, I remember 5 or 6 years ago, someone wrote a virus that stored itself in the BIOS.
Maybe you got some virus that stores itself onto the BIOS, and scrambles video settings. Maybe it's the same virus im talking about, which most antiviruses (including Trend, Norton, and MCafee)
don't detect in a windows enviroment.
here i provide a link to page that describes that kind of viruses."


The CIH virus a couple of years ago would attack the BIOS. Since then most BIOS have built-in virus protection to protect from editing.
It is just strange to me that if this was a virus that caused my video problems, it would have HAD to effect the BIOS. But if it effected the BIOS, then why did the problem go away when I cleaned the virus from the hard drive? If it is a little too coincidental to be a hardware problem, but seems impossible to be a virus.

Quote: "Then again if you are serious about developing something that doesnt require DirectX, you would choose another OS, just for the sheer virri amounts alone is an indication how bad windows manages it."

I am getting more and more interested in LINUX.
I'm afraid that that won't happen any time soon though.

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BatVink
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 12:43
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Wolf, I would hibernate at this time of year. IIRC, it was this time last year that your laptop packed up when you got back from the UK.



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indi
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 13:01
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Quote: ""Finite Improbability Drives....""

hitchikers

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 13:14
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Quote: "Wolf, I would hibernate at this time of year. IIRC, it was this time last year that your laptop packed up when you got back from the UK."


You remember correctly. The only difference is last year when it blew up, I only had ONE DAY REMAINING on my warranty. The first thing that I did was extend it for another year. This year, I still had FOUR days remaining. lol

Quote: "Quote: ""Finite Improbability Drives....""
hitchikers"

I realized that part. I just wasn't sure of how it was meant???


OK, so things are becoming a little more clear. This morning when I woke up, I went to boot my machine and the graphical problem was back. Then it went away. Then it came back. Now it went away again. The problem is now intermitent, which almost definately points to a hardware problem in a STRANGE set of coincidences.

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Kenjar
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 15:25 Edited at: 22nd Nov 2006 15:26
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Sounds like the virus was directly targeting drivers, if indeed there was one. What was the name of the virus? And remember, video drivers and one of the first things to load up, having the virus only react when full SVGA is enabled would be a way of simulating a hardware fault. But until the name of the virus is given it's all speculation.

I lay upon my bed one bright clear night, and gazed upon the distant stars far above, then I thought... where the hell is my roof?
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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 19:50
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Quote: "Sounds like the virus was directly targeting drivers, if indeed there was one. What was the name of the virus? And remember, video drivers and one of the first things to load up, having the virus only react when full SVGA is enabled would be a way of simulating a hardware fault. But until the name of the virus is given it's all speculation."


Nah... Impossible. The graphical problems exist even before the hard disks are detected. So, if it was a virus, it would have had to had attacked the BIOS. The virus's were all Trojans. While I think they may have opened a door to my computer, I don't think anyone ever came in. Right now, I have no ill effects on my laptop (excepth the now intermitent screen problems). I think I dodged the virus bullet, but my laptop needs to be sent in for service

In other news, I am in the process of re-installing Windows on my office PC

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TKF15H
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 22:58
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Quote: "In other news, I am in the process of re-installing Windows on my office PC"

When you're done with that and installing all the basic apps you need, dump it all onto a DVD so the next time windows dies you can just throw it all back in place.

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soapyfish
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Posted: 22nd Nov 2006 23:15
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So now would be a bad time to say Macs OS XxX Roolzorz then?

Seriously though, congrats on at least diagnosing the problem - ish. If it was me i wouldn't have the foggiest.

Kinda makes me think I should renew the warranty on my comp (got a letter the other day reminding me it runs out in about a week).

It would appear I've been bitten by the coding bug yet again...
<º))))><.·´¯`·.Here's to the crazy ones¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º>
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