Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

Geek Culture / Kill Piracy !!!

Author
Message
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 05:14
Link
@Slow Programmer - I'm quite enjoying that movie, thanks


Senior Web Developer - Nokia
Back to top
Profile PM Website
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 07:09 Edited at: 1st Jan 2011 07:10
Link
After watching that film (thanks slow programmer) i think i can agree that the only real way to deal with piracy is to make it less socially respected.
Maybe people need to gain respect for developing companies (you always hear people severely slagging off games, even ones they always play).
One way this could be done is i guess educating people on what really goes on behind the scenes.
Also manuals are good, recent games had forgotten the whole concept of manuals (you just get a slip with basic controls usually now...).

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.

MMORPG -- Many Men Online Role Playing as Girls

G.I.R.L -- Guy In Real Life
Back to top
Profile PM
Herakles
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Mar 2009
Location: Lost in my own head
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 07:16
Link
Quote: "Can somebody give me proof that a more restrictive DRM causes more people to pirate a game, as opposed to my theory that FUN games are pirated more?"


It's like dealing with children. If you tell a child not to do something, he'll get curious and want to do this thing even more (if you've ever had to deal with a child you would know). The harder you try to limit piracy with DRM, the more they are going to want to pirate this game. It is simply that childish facet of human nature.

I don't claim to be a psychologist, but I have learned a thing or two about how people think over the years (especially from my years as a parent).

Back to top
Profile PM
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 07:23
Link
Quote: "It's like dealing with children. If you tell a child not to do something, he'll get curious and want to do this thing even more (if you've ever had to deal with a child you would know). The harder you try to limit piracy with DRM, the more they are going to want to pirate this game. It is simply that childish facet of human nature."

Not really, alot of DRM measures the user doesnt actually notice. Such as a registration key, it takes what 15 seconds? (providing the company doesnt use some weird ass font) to copy it up? I hate it though when i am forced to minimize the game to read emails etc..

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.

MMORPG -- Many Men Online Role Playing as Girls

G.I.R.L -- Guy In Real Life
Back to top
Profile PM
Herakles
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Mar 2009
Location: Lost in my own head
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 08:02
Link
I actually don't mind having to put in a registration key. You just type the code in when you install the game, and that's it. It doesn't interrupt you in the middle of playing the game when the server is having issues, like Assassin's Creed 2, or prevent you from playing the game outright if you have to reinstall it too many times, like SecuROM.

Back to top
Profile PM
Lemonade
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2008
Location:
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 11:37 Edited at: 1st Jan 2011 11:39
Link
I haven't read everything, but I do have to say you're pretty spot on Jeku.

On a related note: I used to listen to music on Grooveshark, but no longer. Here's why:

1. User A uploads a song.
2. User B purchases the song.
3. Most of the profit goes to the user A & GS
4. The artist gets a small (if any at all) percent of the revenue.

Even if it is 'technically' legal, it is still killing the industry.

Even worse is the fact that there is no filter on uploads. Meaning a user can upload a song from any artist, even if GS does not have a license to sell it.

Back to top
Profile PM
Quik
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 12:56
Link
Quote: "Do you use Steam? Do you own a console? They all use DRM. Even indie games on consoles and Steam are under DRM. "


I use consoles, however how can i console require full internet access if i dont have it? and it still works? now i am confused

I have 4 games on steam which i bought before i found out about DRM, MW2, L4D2, CS 1.6 and source

however, both steam and consoles can be played offline
steam has an offline mode and consoles dont need internet at all.
If steam would require 100% internet connection even for offline games, then i wouldnt use it, simple as that. I think steam is great because a lot of reasons, and thats one of them. There is no reason for me to need full internet connection in an offline game, there is no excuse for it, WHY would i need to PAY extra money (internet fee) for an game which SHOULD NOT require internet?


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
Back to top
Profile PM
Plystire
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Feb 2003
Location: Staring into the digital ether
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 14:45 Edited at: 1st Jan 2011 14:48
Link
A lot of interesting ideas going on in here. I enjoyed the idea of flooding the torrents with fakes the most.

It seems that now instead of talking about how to battle piracy, we've moved into an ethical debate about piracy (how most of these discussions end up, I suppose).

Ethics all boils down to who you're talking to. It is not a universal thing. Person A does not necessarily agree with Person B about what is right and wrong. I would prefer not to go into that or debate with someone about what is right and what is wrong. There is no finishing such a debate, because in 90% of cases, neither party will back down from their stance.

Just to throw my 2 cents on the table, I think piracy is something that would be better coped with rather than attacked. Perhaps if a company offered to pay pirates that successfully cracked their system and offered the company viable solutions to prevent such cracks, it may bring a win-win situation to the table. The pirates that are CAPABLE of cracking the system might say "Hey, I can make some money off of this!" while the average joe "downloader pirate" (Which seem to be the MASS MAJORITY of pirates) gets nothing because the pirated version is being sold back to the company instead of being uploaded. Wouldn't this provide the company a cheaper way to increase security while at the same time dampening the piracy rate of their games?
Example:
Company makes game.
Pirate A cracks game protection software, and uploads crack to internet.
Pirate B cracks game protection software same way Pirate A cracked it, then sells method of cracking (along with viable solution to prevent it) back to company.
Company releases patch for game which includes updated security.
Pirate A's crack is now worthless, and Pirate A must now crack game again.
Pirate B made money, and Pirate B now attempts to crack game again for more money.

See where this is going? While Pirate A is uploading cracked game, Pirate B is cracking the game and selling his findings to the company, so they can cover the holes. Pirate A is getting no where since Pirate B is taking advantage of the company's offer. And since Pirate A is getting no where, the lazy joe shmoe downloader pirates aren't getting anywhere either!

Just a thought I had.


The one and only,


Only those who sow the seeds of their desires will reap their benefits later.
However, I have seeds of my own to tend to. I don't have time to be someone else's watering can.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
lazerus
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Apr 2008
Location:
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 14:52
Link
Quote: "Epic post time! I'm sounding like Raven!"


I laughed, the good old days

Heres a very summed up view from me. (i'm still probably drunk so epic posts are not possible right now)


People use Drm as an excuse to rally behind the pirate flag, when in all truth there too cheap/cant afford to buy it. Games are a prvilage to use and play, its not a human right to own them and some people think that because they make millions its perfectly fine for them to take a copy.

So no-ones perfect and its sucks that pirates are influencing game development for the worse. Just stand on moraly high horse and say you had no part in it and blame others of course. Ive "tried before i buy'd" two games each ive bought so i'm clean-ish.

wrote too much need food byby


http://lazerus-reborn.deviantart.com/
Back to top
Profile PM Email
Quik
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 15:28
Link
Quote: "Company makes game.
Pirate A cracks game protection software, and uploads crack to internet.
Pirate B cracks game protection software same way Pirate A cracked it, then sells method of cracking (along with viable solution to prevent it) back to company.
Company releases patch for game which includes updated security.
Pirate A's crack is now worthless, and Pirate A must now crack game again.
Pirate B made money, and Pirate B now attempts to crack game again for more money."


thats basicly whats happening now, for each patch they need to recrack the game usually, so usually it looks like this:

"GAME !!!"
"GAME PATCH 1200321 CRACK!!!"
"GAME PATCH 1200322 CRACK!!!"
aso, and that doesnt really slow it down


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
Back to top
Profile PM
Plystire
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Feb 2003
Location: Staring into the digital ether
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 16:08
Link
I thought what was happening now is that the game devs came up with security solutions themselves. What I'm suggesting is that instead of battling the pirates, you come to a compromise with them. I mean, pirates are obviously pirating your game for a reason aren't they?

I've seen people mention reasons ranging from "Because I can" to "Because I like the challenge". Well, in what way can you make these reasons work in your favor? If they want a challenge, should you not accept that and allow them to take the challenge while keeping them off your back? If they simply want to for grins and giggles, then how does one cope with that? What reasons are there and in what ways can we deal with these various reasons? This may be more of a psychological approach to the matter than a technological approach, but since the technological approach is apparantly failing, what else do you propose?

I mean, if the solution for someone with anger problems is not to punish them but rather allow them to vent their anger in a constructive manner, then how about taking that same approach to piracy and allowing the pirates to vent in a constructive manner?

All I'm saying is that we all know fighting piracy is a losing battle, but who's to say either side has to lose?


The one and only,


Only those who sow the seeds of their desires will reap their benefits later.
However, I have seeds of my own to tend to. I don't have time to be someone else's watering can.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
xplosys
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 16:55 Edited at: 1st Jan 2011 16:55
Link
Plystire,

It's an interesting concept and I'm sure if minds were put to it, some kind of arrangement could be made with some parts of each side. I would be willing to bet that something like this has or is already being done within the companies, though probably not advertised to would be hackers as you propose. I fear that some "giving in to the enemy" reluctance would be strong, especially on the part of the companies. Also, there are other dynamics at play that we haven't mentioned, and a whole new class warfare could ensue, even between hackers who see others as sellouts.

Still, it would make for some challenging and interesting work.

... and the band played on.
Back to top
Profile PM
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 21:03
Link
Quote: " There is no reason for me to need full internet connection in an offline game, there is no excuse for it, WHY would i need to PAY extra money (internet fee) for an game which SHOULD NOT require internet?"


I've got a great answer for that: Don't buy the game, and don't pirate it. It's not your "right" to play.

@Plystire - The social approach to piracy should be to put them in jail or slap them with a fine for stealing, not coddle them Having been a former pirate myself, I did it because I wanted to play the game. I didn't take part in the actual cracking myself, but got to enjoy the fruits of labour from other crackers. There was no mission, and no "venting". It was just me being cheap because I was too young to have a job to pay for the games and my parents didn't stop me. The social battle would only work for the top of the food chain, the crackers themselves, but I highly doubt they would work alongside a Microsoft or an Activision as they're seen as evil.


Senior Web Developer - Nokia
Back to top
Profile PM Website
Quik
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 23:29
Link
Quote: "I've got a great answer for that: Don't buy the game, and don't pirate it. It's not your "right" to play."


obviously it is not, but they WANT me to play dont they`?
otherwise they wouldnt make the game wouldnt they?


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
Back to top
Profile PM
puppyofkosh
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Jan 2007
Location:
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 23:53 Edited at: 1st Jan 2011 23:55
Link
EDIT:

Nevermind
Back to top
Profile PM
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 1st Jan 2011 23:54
Link
Quote: "obviously it is not, but they WANT me to play dont they`?
otherwise they wouldnt make the game wouldnt they?"


They want you to play legally, yes. Simlarly, Nintendo wants you to play Mario Galaxy but they want you to buy a Wii first.


Senior Web Developer - Nokia
Back to top
Profile PM Website
Kevin Picone
22
Years of Service
Recently Online
Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: Australia
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 05:31
Link
The film industry has been trying to sway attitudes / create awareness for years now, but it just falls on the deaf ears. It's no great surprise when the approach they use is a mostly fear orientated (like those anti smoking ads), which is counter productive if you ask me. There's been some better ones recently (focusing on the benefits of owning the real thing), but it's a bit too late now.

The market for boxed PC software has almost disappeared here, some shops still keep a few titles on the shelves, but it's nothing like it was even just a couple of years ago. Piracy is a factor (not helped when our local computer swap meet is now a warez fest), but there's a lot more to it than that. Buying digitally is slowly but surely changing how many of us shop for software/music/movies. So the physical infrastructure isn't really necessary anymore, or so we think.


Obviously, distributing software digitally directly to the customer has more than a few issues in terms of software security. So it's inevitable really that software distributors/developers will move from open (direct to customer) models to more closed systems over time to protect their income. Where the applications can be delivered to the customer in such a way it's tided/customized for the customers system, streamed in an episodic way, or perhaps only exists in RAM. Where ownership becomes more about access than physical possession.

I think many developers will go the free road, where they're remunerated from commission / ad revenue (embedded within program, or site or both), or where the support services are is really what you're paying for. So conceptually shifting the model for customers ideally, from a big outlay to a stream of small micro transactions, even sponsored development would be possible.

but anyway, enough ramble...


Hmm, I wonder what's coming in 2011?
Back to top
Profile PM Website
Herakles
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Mar 2009
Location: Lost in my own head
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 08:40
Link
Quote: "I've got a great answer for that: Don't buy the game, and don't pirate it. It's not your "right" to play."


Obviously. But it's still the company's fault for needlessly forcing us into this situation.

I'm not saying all DRM is bad on principle. On the contrary, I fully believe in making sure the game's developers are compensated for their hard work. But if a game's DRM actually interfere's with a legitimate paying customer's ability to play the game, then it's gone too far.

Again, piracy is not the answer. But neither is punishing non pirates for a crime they did not commit.

Back to top
Profile PM
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 10:24
Link
Quote: "The film industry has been trying to sway attitudes / create awareness for years now"

Not really, all they tell me is that it is stealing.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.

MMORPG -- Many Men Online Role Playing as Girls

G.I.R.L -- Guy In Real Life
Back to top
Profile PM
Kevin Picone
22
Years of Service
Recently Online
Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: Australia
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 11:56
Link
As i said, they're too easy to dismiss, so as a communication the scare tactic approach fails. However, it's clearly targeted at raising what they see as the central problem. That being, making the rather grey area of legality downloadable media, black and white for end users.


Hmm, I wonder what's coming in 2011?
Back to top
Profile PM Website
KeithC
Senior Moderator
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Michigan
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 16:18
Link
Having to utilize the internet to determine that your copy is legit is fine (for a single player game); but requiring a "constant connection" in order to play a single player game is going too far (in my opinion). What happens when either the Master Server goes down, or your own connection becomes unstable (both happen often)? Then you lose not only your momentum (in gameplay), but also perhaps any progress you've made (unless you're saving every few minutes). That is ridiculous, no matter how you slice it.

Sure; if I don't like it, I don't have to buy it. However, what happens to the company's bottom line if a large percentage of potential users take that route as well? I don't think they really want that, do you?

-Keith

Back to top
Profile PM Email
xplosys
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 16:27
Link
Quote: "what happens to the company's bottom line if a large percentage of potential users take that route as well? I don't think they really want that, do you?"


No, of course they don't want that and therefore will change or go under. It's the correct way to effect change; Vote with your dollars. The winner will be whoever gets the most dollars by selling what the most people want. Once you "regulate" use, the company doesn't have to improve or cater to the user because they have the law on their side.

Brian.

... and the band played on.
Back to top
Profile PM
IanM
Retired Moderator
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 11th Sep 2002
Location: In my moon base
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 19:43
Link
Quote: "What happens when either the Master Server goes down, or your own connection becomes unstable (both happen often)?"

Like UBI's for instance.

Or what about when they simply switch it off?

Of course, it doesn't really matter - you don't think you actually own what you've bought anyway, do you? You've only licensed it, and that license can be terminated at any time.

Like others here I can't and won't condone piracy, but what kind of situation is it we find ourselves in when the pirates provide a 'better experience' than the producers?

Get the latest Matrix1Utility plug-ins (23-DEC-2010)
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 20:50 Edited at: 2nd Jan 2011 20:53
Link
Quote: "As i said, they're too easy to dismiss, so as a communication the scare tactic approach fails"

No, like i said. All they tell you is that it is stealing. They do it poorly, if it was done correctly than probably people will listen more.

You dont tell them its wrong, or they will dismiss it. You just explain to them the consequences of their actions, and make the person feel responsible enough to make the decision themselves. That way it makes the individual respect you, and quite possible agree with you. Id do one as an example, but I'm too mic shy =p.

Smoke me a kipper, ill be back for breakfast.

MMORPG -- Many Men Online Role Playing as Girls

G.I.R.L -- Guy In Real Life
Back to top
Profile PM
KeithC
Senior Moderator
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Michigan
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 20:55
Link
That's exactly my point, Ian. Stop punishing the legitimate users. "If you don't like it don't buy it" is a cop-out, in my opinion. As I said; I don't imagine the companies in question would like it if the majority of gamers took that view.

-Keith

Back to top
Profile PM Email
the_winch
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 1st Feb 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posted: 2nd Jan 2011 23:42 Edited at: 2nd Jan 2011 23:42
Link
I don't think they need to worry about the customers not buying it too much. I think a much bigger threat is that the customers start buying content through alternative distribution methods that are competing against each other for the sale.

Once you have the same content for sale through several independent companies there will be pressure to reduce DRM because customers hate it.
These distributors are only interested in their sales not the overall sales of the product. So they do not care if the reduced DRM results in more piracy as long as they are selling more copies.
If the distributors become big enough then you really need to sell through them to maximise profits so they can hold a lot of power.

By way of demonstration, he emitted a batlike squeak that was indeed bothersome.
Back to top
Profile PM Website
crispex
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jun 2007
Location:
Posted: 3rd Jan 2011 12:44
Link
Please note, I am not an advocate of piracy, but I really think that spending money to develop these measures is pure waste.

Every system can be broken. If it requires internet connection, someone makes a program to emulate a fake connection with the validation files. If you need to activate over phone, someone figures out the algorithm. Everything can be cracked.

Now, if you ask me, the real crime is done to the people who pay legit for things. Companies are disrupting the integrity of their programs in order to maintain control over the pirating situation. Often times, this causes people to turn away and shake their head.

Anti-piracy is a dead end trail. The artist Moby even says, chances are if people are torrenting or cracking your things, that must mean they want it bad enough to take the time to do it, and chances are next time they get the extra money they'd purchase the stuff legit.

Not to mention, Adobe even ADMITS Photoshop's fame and notoriety has been strongly accredited towards people who pirate it. They even said that many people have purchased it after pirating it. Some people just like to try before they buy (the full program not some nulled down piece of garbage).

I just now realized I've had a typo in my signature for the past 3 years.
Back to top
Profile PM
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 3rd Jan 2011 22:35
Link
Um, nobody is arguing that people don't try before they buy. But the fact is that it's still illegal. You don't have to repeat the same points again and again


Senior Web Developer - Nokia
Back to top
Profile PM Website
crispex
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jun 2007
Location:
Posted: 4th Jan 2011 01:02
Link
Then what's the point of the thread? There is only two real points, you're either for it or against it.

I just now realized I've had a typo in my signature for the past 3 years.
Back to top
Profile PM
Plystire
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Feb 2003
Location: Staring into the digital ether
Posted: 4th Jan 2011 06:31
Link
For it or against it? This isn't some black and white drawing, this is reality. Hence the need for discussion.


@Jeku:

My proposed idea was to kill the problem at the core. The people who crack the security are the core of the problem. Without them, there are no cracks to download, right?

In my eyes, these people are very smart and technically inclined, and you would be hard pressed to fabricate a security protocol to defeat them! Obviously, since making more security isn't going to work, then there must be a better option to defeat the problem at the core. My example of offering rewards to the crackers for their work in defeating your security was an idea that perhaps instead of shunning these people, accept them for what they are and perhaps benefit from their talents.


The one and only,


Only those who sow the seeds of their desires will reap their benefits later.
However, I have seeds of my own to tend to. I don't have time to be someone else's watering can.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
crispex
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jun 2007
Location:
Posted: 5th Jan 2011 12:26
Link
Actually, many companies do hire hackers to improve their product security. However, many also decline because they feel they have a moral duty to help those who can't afford the products. I know 3 people in a crack team, and they do it because they feel companies ask way too much for software.

Eventually things will lean toward Open Source anyway, so what does it really matter?

I just now realized I've had a typo in my signature for the past 3 years.
Back to top
Profile PM
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 6th Jan 2011 03:49
Link
@crispex
How can you buy food when what you do for a living makes nothing.

Back to top
Profile PM
crispex
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jun 2007
Location:
Posted: 6th Jan 2011 04:40
Link
Quote: "How can you buy food when what you do for a living makes nothing."


Most of these hackers have normal day jobs. Not everyone is a basement dweller.

I just now realized I've had a typo in my signature for the past 3 years.
Back to top
Profile PM
Toasty Fresh
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: In my office, making poly-eating models.
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 12:25
Link
Quote: "Actually, many companies do hire hackers to improve their product security. However, many also decline because they feel they have a moral duty to help those who can't afford the products. I know 3 people in a crack team, and they do it because they feel companies ask way too much for software."


Too much? Considering the amount of work that goes into a game these days 60 USD is very cheap. Fallout New Vegas, I've played that for at least 120 hours. So, that's essentially 50 cents for every hour of entertainment. That is a BARGAIN. Games are amazingly cheap these days, if they're good games.

So if they're not good games why would you want to pirate them anyway?
Back to top
Profile PM Email
Quik
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 12:41
Link
nice bump lol

60USD is a LOT for what we get

a usualy FPS game is finished in 24 hours or LESS, and we pay60 USDfor that?
the only games which is, if we take ur example, worth it is the RPG games, which do actually keep a lot of entertainment hours in them..RTS go in there aswell

but the typical FPS or Action game is 24 or less.


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
Back to top
Profile PM
Kevin Picone
22
Years of Service
Recently Online
Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: Australia
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 13:32
Link
On a per hour basis, that's only you 2.5$ per hour.


Hmm, I wonder what's coming in 2011?
Back to top
Profile PM Website
Isocadia
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Jul 2009
Location:
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 16:05
Link
Well, WoW kosts me less than 50 cents a day, so still cheaper, and often more epic
Back to top
Profile PM
TheComet
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Oct 2007
Location: I`m under ur bridge eating ur goatz.
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 17:40
Link
Millions were spent on the security system for BluRay, and 2 weeks after it's release it was hacked. I mean, look at DavidR's sig! Now everyone knows it (not blaming you DavidR ) How can 10 top programmers that work for BluRay have even the slightest chance against a whole world of hackers? It's useless to try and stop pirating, and it's useless to waste brain space on security systems. If it was made by humans, it can be cracked by humans.

TheComet

Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 18:04
Link
Quote: "a usualy FPS game is finished in 24 hours or LESS, and we pay60 USDfor that?"

it doesn't take 24hours to make an fps game o.o

Back to top
Profile PM
xplosys
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 18:32 Edited at: 14th Jan 2011 18:33
Link
Now that all is said and done, we've learned that piracy can't be stopped. The very nature of media and the internet in it's current state make it impossible. Changing the nature of the media means everyone and everything will need to be updated or replaced by new technology... not a viable or effective option if companies want to continue selling it without a huge and expensive changeover period.

So what is the most effective means of fighting it currently available? Is it forcing everyone to have a constant internet connection to some server, and how easy is that to bypass or recode?

... and the band played on.
Back to top
Profile PM
Ocho Geek
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 16th Aug 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posted: 14th Jan 2011 23:24
Link
If a new form of the world wide web ran through a central controlled and policed hub, having the content accessible Physically only through the central hub (or hubs, one per county may be better) you would effectively stop web crime. the problem is making the old internet redundant.

Ocho Geek - Pretending to be a useful contribution to the forums since 2005
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Herakles
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Mar 2009
Location: Lost in my own head
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 05:37
Link
Quote: "If a new form of the world wide web ran through a central controlled and policed hub, having the content accessible Physically only through the central hub (or hubs, one per county may be better) you would effectively stop web crime. the problem is making the old internet redundant."


Goodbye, freedom of speech. It was nice knowing you.

Back to top
Profile PM
DJ Almix
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Feb 2006
Location: Freedom
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 06:07
Link
Quote: "Quote: "If a new form of the world wide web ran through a central controlled and policed hub, having the content accessible Physically only through the central hub (or hubs, one per county may be better) you would effectively stop web crime. the problem is making the old internet redundant.""


I want quite the opposite, as what you said defeats the purpose of the internet. The internet is supposed to be unchained and uncensored, a basic blank slate, that people can modify with information and rules as the please. It's like tiny societies (websites) and each one has different rules then the other and each one provides something to the people who visit it.

In your case, it might just be people questioning whats right and wrong, and it might just turn into a big cluster funk of people saying "this is right" and "this is wrong".


Go on...click the bar to enter a world of awesome.
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 09:30 Edited at: 15th Jan 2011 09:33
Link
Quote: "The internet is supposed to be unchained and uncensored"

No it is not.
The internet is supposed to not rely on 1 specific hub, because if that hub was nuked it would cease to work. That is the concept behind the internet, and why it doesnt have the ability to be censored.
However, as everyone knows we do rely on our own 'hub' (so to speak) which is our ISP, so the ISP has the ability to control their portion of the internet.

Quote: ""this is right" and "this is wrong""

We already have that, its called laws.

The idea around ACTA was right, but the way they delivered it was wrong.

Back to top
Profile PM
Benjamin
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Nov 2002
Location: France
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 09:53
Link
Quote: "So what is the most effective means of fighting it currently available? Is it forcing everyone to have a constant internet connection to some server, and how easy is that to bypass or recode?"


All you can really do is make buying the game more attractive than pirating it; for example design the game exclusively for multiplayer and require a registered account to play on official servers and interact with the server browser. You will still get pirates that will run their own cracked servers, but it's more attractive to buy the game since you can play with the majority of players instead of a few servers populated by hackers and cheaters.

Alternately wait for cloud gaming to develop, it if ever happens.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 11:38 Edited at: 15th Jan 2011 11:38
Link
Quote: "cloud gaming"

I dont want to choke my bandwidth to play a singleplayer game...

Back to top
Profile PM
BiggAdd
Retired Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Aug 2004
Location: != null
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 11:41 Edited at: 15th Jan 2011 11:42
Link
Quote: "I dont want to choke my bandwidth to play a singleplayer game..."


You might think differently when Gigabit internet is the norm.

Back to top
Profile PM
xplosys
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 15th Jan 2011 15:06
Link
Quote: "If a new form of the world wide web ran through a central controlled and policed hub"


That's not anything I would want to participate in. I sounds like one of those things that would take mandatory participation and regulation/fees to stay afloat. Who would control/police it?

Quote: "Goodbye, freedom of speech. It was nice knowing you"


Exactly! Anyway, I think Benjamin is on the right track. We don't need more laws and regulations that cannot be enforced and people can ignore. The free market needs to evolve and adapt.

Brian.

... and the band played on.
Back to top
Profile PM
Quik
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 16th Jan 2011 11:40
Link
lets just put up cameras everywhere aswell shall we?


[Q]uik, Quiker than most
Back to top
Profile PM
Fatal Berserker
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2010
Location:
Posted: 16th Jan 2011 11:51
Link
Quote: "put up cameras everywhere aswell shall we?"

Their called CCTV, their already everywhere.

Back to top
Profile PM
Back to top

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2025-05-22 16:01:30
Your offset time is: 2025-05-22 16:01:30