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Geek Culture / check this out - future of computer graphics!!!

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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 09:55
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http://unlimiteddetailtechnology.com/

I am just amazed by this new technology, no more polys
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Rampage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:06
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Wow. If they can pull this off. Commercially sell it to companies. We're gonna be seeing some serious @$@&&@#(#*#_)@_)@(#@#*(^#@!^%&! in the next year. Not to mention they are gonna be freaking RICH.
Argh.... Technology is developing so fast. Can't imagine where it will be when the end of my life comes.


Eidos!
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:11
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[Removed by a Moderator; Contained explicit language detailing how happy he was]

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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:22
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I know rampage, I don't think people like ati or nvidia will like it, no more overpriced simple gcards, and lol FB
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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:25 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 10:25
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http://www.euclideon.com/press.html and check this out, there making the sdk!
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:25
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i found a good youtube video:


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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:27 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 10:28
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That's how I found it, im on a phone so I can't post videos or hyperlinks. Thaks for outing it up and my speel check screws up my words lol
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Rampage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:30
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Wow and that press release was last year. This is amazing. ARGH.
This will be a roundhouse kick to the faces of ati and nvidia. I thought I would be dealing with this kinda stuff in the next 50 years but not now.
And they are going to release demo's... To EVERYONE!!!


Eidos!
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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:34
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I know im so happy I found it when I did, on one of there vids they sayed they miight accally team up w/ nvita or ati
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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:38
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I wonder if it uses dx or ogl :/ hopefully dx of the 9th varity
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Rampage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:38
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Which ever one of them offers the most money. Massive flood hit Brisbane today. Hope they didn't loose anything important


Eidos!
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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:41
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Oh man that would suck, if there smart they've got backups on off site servers
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Rampage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:44
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Can't imagine what its going to look like when professional artists get there hands on it. All the modeling done in the pics and videos from a programmer!


Eidos!
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:46 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 10:50
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Im just imagining the effect this will have on video games.
Downloads for games like crysis would probably exceed 100gb, with whole countries in 1 single game.

(What is being ran is apparently all on laptops. AKA NO super computers)

I hope Google doesnt buy them out...

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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:50 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 10:52
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Lol now I can understand why hl2 was 2 fps, and all they had of crysis was pics lol

When those pro artitists get ahold of it its gonna be like movie sfx in games
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:54 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 10:55
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Imagine the particles!
The roar of fire!
The drip of water!

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Rampage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:55
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Quote: "Downloads for games like crysis would probably exceed 100gb, with whole countries in 1 single game."

People would still have to develop it. So I'm gonna say no on the countries in one game Not sure about file size either. If i'm not mistaken the file size of a 3d model is polygon orientated. And this eliminated it. But they would need polygons to convert and ... argh.
Confusing. I know very little about the 3d artist world


Eidos!
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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:57
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Oh man its like each of the particals would be dust size
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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 10:59
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I know only enough modeling to get me along by myself programming, I suck tho lol
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 11:26
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@Rampage they said you can convert polygon files, and scan photos with various other methods =S

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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 11:31
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I doubt photo scans would look good but you never know
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David R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 11:57 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 12:02
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Eurgh, not this scam again

This has appeared on the forum once before, and pretty much universally regarded as a vaporware scam/hoax.

What they describe makes partial sense (the point cloud search) but that in itself is not a revolutionary concept, nor does it enable 'unlimited detail' (any time you see the word 'unlimited' on anything computing related, your hoax alarms should be going off)

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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 12:14
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you serios? why do you think its a hoax?

dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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Benjamin
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 12:16 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 12:17
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http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=167138&b=2

Quote: "The result is a perfect pure bug free 3D engine that gives Unlimited Geometry running super fast, and it's all done in software."




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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 12:33
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I actually really like this whole idea, it seemes to be pretty awesome. the only thing i am skeptical about which leads me to believe that in fact it is a hoax is ive been hearing about this for 2 years already and no new details have been released ever since then. I am guessing its pretty dead by now. I also doubt that ATI and NVIDIA would let this thing go trough because it will ultimatley make both of these companies obsolete. Well maybe not quite, even tho they said it can run on just software, but as i have seen in the videos, its a little choppy. so maybe hardware acceleration would help this technology. and considering how powerful graphics cards are today, compared to what i have seen UGT being rendered just with software, modern graphics cards will help get the most out of this technology. And the really expensive graphics cards would be a complete overkill. Seeing that this technology is dependednt on the screen resolution, it may lead to the development of much higher res gaming screens for this kind of thing. But the higher screen res there is, the more powerful hardware it may need.

dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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Van B
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 12:54
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I'm sceptical. If you consider how much memory will be needed to store all those points, let's say they were just true colour pixels - and your PC has 32gb of memory... you have the memory to display a block of 2000x2000x2000 - that is hardly infinite, in fact that's fairly finite IMO - and that's just colour information.

Then what about animation? - each of those points would need to be calculated and adjusted according to a moving skeleton. That's fine when your talking about a couple of hundred vertexes per bone - but when your adjusting millions of points, that's not viable. I haven't seen any videos with animation in them.

Also, what has progressed in the last year? - no new images, no new videos, no news...

I think it has it's applications, but videogames are not one of them, and never will be (at least not in my lifetime).

Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
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Fatal Berserker
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 13:16
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They released some news in September saying they now had financial backing.

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ShaunRW
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 15:11 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 15:12
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Even if this would work, i can't see this replacing the current system anytime soon.


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SH4773R
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 15:56
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I think it will start out like bluray did, not many people seeing take off, then bam afew months and their ritch
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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 19:31
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Unlike this blue ray is an outdated technology which they bloated up as much as they could to make money off. All it is a cdrom drive with a much tinier laser and supr compressed data on the disk.The only good thing blue ray was for is videogame consoles. i see no reason to have a BD on my computer. the point is removable disk drives are sloow. also at the very start it was all clear that whoever wins, BD or HD DVD will be the mainstream after that. i am also becoming skeptical of this technology.

BTW someone was asking how to animate this data!, well in the video i saw a little scorpion thing being animated so i think they got it.

dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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lazerus
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 19:49
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Quote: "Eurgh, not this scam again "


Same reaction when i read the first post lol


http://lazerus-reborn.deviantart.com/
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Phaelax
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 20:00
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Quote: "I wonder if it uses dx or ogl "

its software rendered

Anyone else notice their fly-by camera lags on the large scenes?

I'm not really impressed by the pictures or video. Everything looks pixelated and low quality to me. Maybe we won't be talking about poly count in the future but what's the DPI of your model?

How is this different from voxels?

"Only the educated are free" ~Epictetus
"Imagination is more important than knowledge..." ~Einstein
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thenerd
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 20:52 Edited at: 11th Jan 2011 20:56
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Quote: "
I'm not really impressed by the pictures or video. Everything looks pixelated and low quality to me. Maybe we won't be talking about poly count in the future but what's the DPI of your model?
"

I agree, as a simulation it seems impressive, but I doubt it would ever work in a game: the style caused by the dots isn't very visually appealing... Even if the system works, it would not be practical in a video game.

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Rampage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 21:32
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Ahwell. I guess we will just have to wait and see.


Eidos!
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DJ Almix
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 21:45
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That is..if something actually happens, these people don't do anything anymore...


Go on...click the bar to enter a world of awesome.
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Neuro Fuzzy
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Posted: 11th Jan 2011 22:59
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Yeah, I'll wait till there's a playable demo and a game made with it to judge it.



Quote: "The result is a perfect pure bug free 3D engine that gives Unlimited Geometry running super fast, and it's all done in software."

^^^this sounds incredibly retarded tho xD

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Math89
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 00:00
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Quote: "How is this different from voxels?"

Voxels are on a grid, and therefore, suffer from aliasing. This one is apparently a huge array of points (xyz coordinate + colour). I think they can manage to store lots of data by repeating the same model a few thousand times (look! unlimited data! but only if you have only 3 models pasted all over the world).

After watching the second video, it seems that their method is also prone to some heavy aliasing during closeups, so 'unlimited details' seems a bit extreme. Also I suspect that the geometry can't be animated because of the cost of updating the space partitioning structure.
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Rampage
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 02:08
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A way to eliminate (maybe) the animation struggles would be to have all the static geometry made using this method, and somehow all the stuff that needs to be animated using polygons could be put into the game (characters, guns, trees, etc.) with more poly's seeing as the engine and hardware doesn't have to worry about any other poly's.


Eidos!
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thenerd
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 02:40
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That might work, but I would think that there would be an inconsistency because of the fact that the polygon-based objects would look different than the point-based objects.
Personally, I like polygons.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 03:44
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Yes, i agree, i love polygons, and would hate to see them go! In fact, i think any realistic looking game or animation ive seen is anything but, all cartoon looking! I am totally skeptical of this algorithm unless someone gives me a software download-demo that shows me it works. Even if it does really do what it shows in the vid, it's still CERTAINLY not unlimited. I think the videos are animation, if you pay attention to the narrator, he sometimes says, "oh, i dont know what this game is" like he's narrating a premade video. It has to be animated, someone, tell me im wrong if i am. My point is, it's a good idea, but i think it's a hoax And i dont think the whole game industry would convert over to this algorithm.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 04:01
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Also, a mod on another post had a very good point, with this many points, collision detection is just plain not feasible.

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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 04:47
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in the video they did have some scorpon thingy animated so maybe it is possible. the way animation can work with polygons is the polygons can animate to strech to any size and manipulate them any way you want. I think the way this system would do it is make an animated model out of several static models and have those models move and turn. Being a point data mesh it might actually look more seamless when 2 pieces (like a knee joint) are animating as its possible to have both of the parts with rough surfaces. If you look at some of the older games like the original GTA3 you will notice its made out of static poly meshes that just move when animated. But because they are flat surfaces you can see seams and clipping. With rough surface point data model it might actually make such a thing look good

dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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Herakles
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 06:07
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I notice that, in both of the videos on their site, they never zoom in on an object to show that it is all geometry rather than just a bump map. In one of the videos, the guy claims that all of the pebbles on the ground are all geometry. Well, if they really wanted me to believe that this is real, they would show me those pebbles close up so that I could see that it was all geometry and not just a standard terrain with a bump map.

Even if they could get a mesh with an infinite amount of detail being rendered at an acceptable frame rate, how would physics work with that?

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 06:59
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The thing is guys, the only real thing that this can possible be is a hoax. If it sounds to good to be true, chances are it's not

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Neuro Fuzzy
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 07:51
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Quote: "I notice that, in both of the videos on their site, they never zoom in on an object to show that it is all geometry rather than just a bump map."

Arrghh, I know, right? Regardless of whether or not the technology works, the advertising they're doing is unreliable and stupid. The videos are all this dude talking about how great this is, and never showing any bad side to the rendering method! Why wouldn't you zoom up until you saw some points if you wanted to actual make a demonstration video, instead of just some advertisement?

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TheComet
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 12:38
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lol, this is just plain stupid... Although you could compare it to something like a 3D fractal zoomer... A 3D fractal has infinite points, but the rendering algorithm "searches" for the "closest", and therefore you can render a 3D fractal at real time. Still... fractals have a specific formula, where this technology doesn't...

TheComet

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RUCCUS
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 19:29
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This is actually fairly old tech. IIRC almost 2 years ago someone posted about the exact same videos, it might've even been me . Its a cool idea though.
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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 21:45
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despite of how much a scam it seemes, i really wish this was real. It could make large terrains much easier to make. as far as i am concerned and how i did it with DB, i made a huge terrain in t.ED (took up a load of video ram) and split it up into 32x32 models and had them connected in the game. It was still pretty limited tho.

if what they say is true about their search algorithms and only taking up memory to cover nececeary pixels on the screen, then that means, you could jus make really hige terrains out of point data and not worry about splitting up the model or seams in between terrain areas. you can just infinatley keep molding the stuff

dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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JLMoondog
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 22:09
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The 'graphic detail' is amateur aesthetically at best. I've seen much more impressive graphics using good ol'e polys.

Honestly what would be the practical use of this tech in video games?

I'd say this would be of better use in the medical field. Say a doctor takes scans of a person's organ, then using this tech combined with holo-projection( ) he could then easily find problems and or other details that cannot be seen normally.

Well, if it's real.


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bitJericho
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Posted: 12th Jan 2011 22:16
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http://www.advsys.net/ken/voxlap/voxlap03.htm

Yay voxels.

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