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Geek Culture / What do you think is the most hardest part about creating a game?

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maho76
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 14:51
Quote: "What do you think is the most hardest part about creating a game?"


To gain the power in mind and heart to walk the whole path up to the end.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 14:52
Well I guess it does, awesome. I think from now on, you're Dr Simon.


WLGfx
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 15:49
@Jeku - That is actually something I've never thought of before and is now being used religiously from now on. Thanks.

@Seppuka & @Fallout - I've found that myself over the years talking through my project. Many times the penny drops. Unfortunately these days I don't have many people that will listen to me talking through my code. :-(

Mental arithmetic? Me? (That's for computers) I can't subtract a fart from a plate of beans!
Warning! May contain Nuts!
Fallout
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 16:16
@WLGfx

It's a sad sad coder who doesn't have an imaginary friend to talk to.

Van B
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 17:08
For me the hardest part is adapting. Let me explain - I can design a game in my head, or watch another game, and instantly know how it's done. I imagine a lot of people here are like that - we don't need design documents, we need left alone to figure it out, then a leash during the whole implimentation stage. It's not solely a thing that you learn from writing games, I think it comes from education. I studied technical drawing, in fact I was the very last person to study technical drawing at my school - I missed the exam in 4th year, so took the class again in 5th year, and obliterated the final exam . Anyway, technical drawing teaches you to imagine 3D objects in your head based on line drawings. 3D artists will have this as well, just through practice. I'm not sure what they call it, spacial cognition or something hoity-toity like that. Anyway, it applies to game design perfectly, instead of imagining how cool your game will look, imagine how it works, how things move, how things react. Spend enough time thinking like that, and your game eventually gets set in stone, all done bar the actual development. You already know how the game engine has to work, you already know what data the particles need, you already know how to make the sky look like you decided how it should look. (anuerism)

My point is that the most important thing in game development is practice. Things might seem daunting, until you program them a few times - then it becomes instinct... you can imagine every facet of your game idea. The problems arise when you try to explain it to someone negative, or you have to plan it - that's when programmers need a little organisational help sometimes. Without that help, someone to help push the project to completion, well procrastination sets in, and that spells doom. Obviously a game project can be finished, and this can all be disregarded - but what I'm talking about it realising that original game idea in full, and not settle for the game you end up making, spend another year on it, go big or go home, why are you crying?...

Last paragraph I promise. Maybe game development is a bit like getting your hair waxed... like people compliment you and congratulate you, like waxy honey stuff smothered over your bits... but then sometimes it's good to have an honest (potentially bitter) person come along, and rip the hair right off your back. Quick, panful, and honest critique is a valuable thing - don't squander it by looking for compliments... dig for more details, let them tell you what they really think, and damn if you don't secretly think those things as well. It leads to a much more solid game at the end of the day.

So I'd say, the most difficult part of game dev is all the stuff that happens after you think you've finished writing your game. That and finding decent sound effects.

Health, Ammo, and bacon and eggs!
Alien002
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 18:12
for me the hardest part of makeing a game is the graphics i can't draw to save my life.
RalphY
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 19:41
Quote: "I can't remember what it's called, but basically you imagine Fred (in your case, Simon) is sitting next to you asking you what the problem is and how the code works"

Are you referring to rubber duck debugging? Lost count of the number of problems that duck has solved for me.

Go banana! | Super Nintendo Chalmers! | When I grow up I'm going to Bovine University!
Fallout
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 20:01
Quote: "Are you referring to rubber duck debugging? Lost count of the number of problems that duck has solved for me."


That's the one, though I think I heard it referred to as "Cardboard Programmer" now I see that in the similar terms. Stupid, but it works.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 20:11 Edited at: 28th Feb 2012 20:12
I don't have a rubber duck, but I have a little Chewbacca that growls when I push a button, I'm sure Chewy will suffice.


WLGfx
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 21:31
I've ask my missus to go out tomorrow and buy me a rubber duck. My normal method is the "Thinking Out Loud" but with not having many people that'll listen to me waffling on about code I'll talk to the rubber duck instead.

That's the best idea ever for debugging...

Mental arithmetic? Me? (That's for computers) I can't subtract a fart from a plate of beans!
Warning! May contain Nuts!
Fallout
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Posted: 28th Feb 2012 23:00
I will take a penguin into the office with me tomorrow.

Meows
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 15:29
Interesting thread, I write stories, and have made HOM maps for years. the hardest part for me is i get 3/4 done with a project and another story or project takes my interest mostly i guess is because at 3/4 through you realize you have improved your game so much you have to go back to level one and rewrite everything to balance the content of the game with the improvments you have made as you go.

yes in rereading above it makes no sense except to me. so sorry no brain so no gain,

Life is a short trip to another world
Quik
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 15:45
Quote: "Interesting thread, I write stories, and have made HOM maps for years. the hardest part for me is i get 3/4 done with a project and another story or project takes my interest mostly i guess is because at 3/4 through you realize you have improved your game so much you have to go back to level one and rewrite everything to balance the content of the game with the improvments you have made as you go.

yes in rereading above it makes no sense except to me. so sorry no brain so no gain,
"


I know what you mean, if youre easily inspired then its very easy to trail off and do something else in the middle of a project. I am the same I might add x)


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
old_School
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 17:11
Quote: "Interesting thread, I write stories, and have made HOM maps for years. the hardest part for me is i get 3/4 done with a project and another story or project takes my interest mostly i guess is because at 3/4 through you realize you have improved your game so much you have to go back to level one and rewrite everything to balance the content of the game with the improvments you have made as you go."


That’s why you document everything, outline everything best you can and write a rough draft for everything on paper first. I use to make the software and then write the story too then ended up having to go back and redo parts of it. I quickly learned that is bad and wastes a lot of time. Planning the project is key to success.

I've read through a lot of these responses and It makes me wonder how many of you have unfinished projects due to just various little hang ups. So I guess that’s a good question for everyone. How many of you have unfinished projects due to little hang-ups where you simply failed to organize your project resulting in scraping it or not finishing it?

I my self have several older projects I scraped because I did not plan ahead of time in the beginning. Until recently I did not plan ahead my self at all. I just wrote as I went which was a mistake and I know this now. This is also why I can honestly say "programming" is not the hard part for me. It’s not hard because I already wrote it down on paper roughly how I’m going to logically write the software. If I run into a problem, I simply ask on the MSDN for advice/solution.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 17:14 Edited at: 1st Mar 2012 17:33
'Easily inspired', I like that, I'll use that in future, it's a perfect cover for my 'easily distracted'. I used to be like that with my projects - "this idea is great, lets go for this, no this, no wait this". But now, I'm not allowed new project ideas, I've had too many of them and once they're complete only then can I be a cat chasing a laser pointer once again.

Proof that I'm easily inspired, I should be building levels right now, not perusing through the forums.

To answer your question Old_school, my failures could be put down to 2 main things: lack of realism and lack of knowledge and they also go hand in hand. I've always had a plan, but the plan was for the game design, but never a fully fleshed out plan of the coding itself. Since I started I have seen how other people plan their game components and how they're coded and how that code interacts with each other.

Most of my knowledge actually comes from learning from my mistakes...it's an effective way to learn, but I should have started simple when I started game creation and learn from other people, not jump in with the plans for an RPG - I assumed I could make one because I knew how to code a simple battle system (very basic now that I look back). Now that I have the skill and more realism, my current project has reached a stage none of my previous ones have. Throw in what I wrote earlier in this post, it's no wonder nothing ever got finished. However, I still think they were all good ideas and they won't go to waste.

The code was half planned, it wasn't that great so then I planned out the restructure of it before overhauling the code, which is a lot more effective. Obviously you can't plan everything out, you might make changes later because you think they'll work better or add new things, but I think it helps to have a good sense of direction and some structure...structure is especially important because it can help you build on top of code and also track down bugs more easily.


Quik
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 17:59
Quote: "'Easily inspired', I like that, I'll use that in future, it's a perfect cover for my 'easily distracted'. I used to be like that with my projects"


those go hand in hand in the subject, if you are easily distraced by your own inspiration (like me)

Say you are working at something, and then you come up with "an ever better and more interesting" idea in the middle way through, then I easily get distracted by that and trail away from current project..


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
Fallout
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 20:25
I used to get distracted a lot and keep switching to new ideas. I think that happens for one of several reasons.

If you fail to fully design, you fail to define full scope of the project. This leaves you without a clear end goal, and therefore a sense of futility can creep in, and you won't have a clear value for what you've done so far. Also if you're either incapable of making the project, or it's not feasible (because your design is way too over the top), you'll have the same problem.

To complete a game, I would say save technical challenges for proof of concepts, experimenting and engine design. When you actually plan on making a game, everything needs to be well within your ability/knowledge, so the time and design are accurate. Planning something like "Write mental physics engine" is a bit of work that will probably stall your project. Make sure you can make your mental physics engine before you make it a component of your project.

Of course, sometimes your idea just sucks and your new one actually is a lot better, but with proper design, you'll realise your idea sucks before you waste time on it.

Just my 2 centipedes.

Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 03:19
The hardest part for me is that I feel like I'm in solitary confinement for many months at a time. Apart from that I can do everything.

But before I sound crazy...

I spend 3 days wearing headphones to create the music.
I spend about a month in Photoshop creating the graphics.
I spend about 6 months programming.

When I go to the pub on a Saturday my mind is on the current bug.
When I go to bed I hear the music all night in my head.

And then there is the maths...

I can spend 3 years thinking about the maths for my next project whilst I am working on 6 other projects.

It doesn't sound healthy. But for some reason I am a hobbyist who can't sit, and do nothing. I can't sit on a beach for longer than 10 minutes. I can remember right back to the age of 4 just drawing none stop. Now I'm 49, and I got a speccy in 1980, I started programming it on day 1. That's 32 years with some sort of programming going on in the back of my head.

I think the actual hardest part of games, and app making is stopping.

WLGfx
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 10:41
Yeah, I'm Easily Inspired too. Lots of great ideas, and lots of re-writing my code. I used to struggle with the maffs side a lot years ago but not so much these days. Search engines have helped me tons with that.

But on the subject of distractions, only yesterday our house took some bad damage. The boiler bust and everywhere was flooded. Apart from the snippets and posts I've got on my website, I've lost everything from my last umpteen months of coding. Luckily enough, one computer in the house still works and the tinterweb does too.

So it's, "Back to the drawing board." And maybe the last project I was on will be better this time round with this distraction.

Everything is still in my head, even the last bug that was bugging me.

Mental arithmetic? Me? (That's for computers) I can't subtract a fart from a plate of beans!
Warning! May contain Nuts!
3d point in space
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 18:37
I am currently making a game engine for agk I find it quite difficult.

already have a game parser and stuff like that. I just think that I should not post up in those boards so much so I think I post here instead.

Developer of Space Chips, pianobasic, zipzapzoom, and vet pinball apps.
Developed the tiled map engine seen on the showcase.
Veterian for the military.

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