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AppGameKit Classic Chat / App Game Kit 108 Beta 17

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fog
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Posted: 13th Aug 2013 19:37 Edited at: 13th Aug 2013 19:38
@xGEKKOx

I think we all understand what you want in a "Light version", but I haven't fully understood why you need it yet.

Quote: "...and i think all the coders must use it, as the EXTRAS are too different from OS to OS."
I've seen AppGameKit releases on iOS that include the extras and seemingly work fine. What issues are you experiencing?

If there really is a problem using these on iOS then we all need to know about it so TGC can fix it rather than remove it.

Thanks.

xCept
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Posted: 13th Aug 2013 21:00
Quote: "Not sure if it's your translation or not, but I really don't think a cut down version is at all what most people here want my friend. In fact, a great many people were both keen and excited for everything you want removed. Lol."


He is referring specifically to the Tier 2 Lite version being stripped of everything except the core AppGameKit library so there won't be any library conflicts. Those features will of course remain bundled with the Tier 1 BASIC and Tier 2 Full package. Gekko has done a lot of work in Tier 2 iOS, in such a way that his own extensions and libraries seem to conflict with those that are bundled with AGK.
Zwarteziel
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Posted: 13th Aug 2013 21:35 Edited at: 13th Aug 2013 21:41
@xGEKKOx: do I understand correctly that some parts of the current ' full' beta-versions cause technical or legal difficulties when you submit them to the Apple store? If that is the case, I can understand why you would want a light version of AGK. Even so, TGC probably do want to hear what exactly is causing you trouble, since it doesn't seem other users have the same experience when submitting their apps.

I don't quite understand why you would like to see the 3D commands removed though. I myself use them extensively and can't recall that their operation causes platform-specific errors or requires specific programming. Is it mainly a personal preference since you don't use them?

EDIT: just read xCept's post. I think I understand the motivations more clearly. Still don't see the need for 3D-removal though
Santman
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Posted: 13th Aug 2013 23:07
Ah, now his post is more clear to me too, that makes much more sense. I read it as he was implying that the majority of people also wanted those features removed.
JimHawkins
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Posted: 13th Aug 2013 23:27
What's the point of removing 3D? If you don't need it, don't use it. It's all 3D anyway in the underlying engine.

-- Jim DO IT FASTER, EASIER AND BETTER WITH AppGameKit FOR PASCAL
Jammy
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 01:01
Quote: "We admit that we have created too many products and spread ourselves thin at times and we'll not be making that mistake again"


I love how TGC think big. I love how you manage not only to stay current, but also 2 steps ahead. I Still don't see how the likes of "Freedom Engine" was a mistake. It was a great idea which I hope you will return to in the future. I was using it the other day on an Ubuntu machine running chromium and was yet again amazed at its power.

I love how you support upcoming products, Like oculus rift in FPSC reloaded (any chance of AGK2 doing that ?).

Don't stop thinking big and keep up the great work.

xGEKKOx
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 01:10 Edited at: 14th Aug 2013 01:18
THX xCept! You understood!!!

Zerotown - Yes, i don't mind of 3D functions. Is only a delegate problem, as i develop some functions by myself in Obj C like AudioUnits, Channel Mixing, Echo, Reverb, etc.... And Multiplayer with my Linux Server and Game Center, and Push notification with OBJ C.... ect, etc.... on Apple, when you need to produce and earn, better you do what they ask in the rules documentation, or you lose money, much money!!!

Yes Santman, i understand on Android, but on iOS, is useless.
This is the exact reason, why i think TGC must divide the version.

Is impossible to do a cross platform engine with iOS, except if you include only 2D. (3D is incomplete, so for me AppGameKit have no 3D).

TGC must understand this...
Android and Windows 8 users can share the engine because they use windows to code.

We use XCode and Obj C, and you need to handle all delegates in the way you want, not in the way AppGameKit need somewhere.

If someone use Obj C please help me to explain this point, maybe as i'm italian i can't speak english very well.

Is not my needle, is the needle of every OBJ C coders that think to buy AppGameKit as their engine.

If you want i can post about 20 trick to avoid AppGameKit template bug and (AGK) apple rejection.
But if i'm the only one with iOS, maybe it's me the one have to change.

That's all.
Is always and only a suggestion for the newcomers that wanna code in obj c with AGK.
They will find limits when they will arrive at the point i'm arrived.

Now, think....
October Apple will release Sprite Kit... with all the things AppGameKit have inside and more...
and when i say all, i mean ALL...

Now, in your opinion, Obj C coders, will use AppGameKit or Apple Framework?
Will AppGameKit lose all their Apple customers in future?
Will they thinking to support only Android and Windows customers?
When the Kickstarter funds will be spent, what they will do if the Apple customers will use another engine?
Do you know that Google earn thanks to Apple???
Do you know that Android accept every kind of app you send them??
Do you expect your app will sell on Android or you wanna do free apps all life long?

Well i can continue for hour and hour, but for the moment i'm ok.
I thanks the TGC work done till today, they permitted me to rise from the ground...
I will sure buy the V2 to thanks the team, even if i will never do 3D games, but i will wait the September end to port all apps under sprite kit. I read all the documentation and i think is really great.




Long life to Steve!
The Zoq2
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 01:12
Freedom engine in itself is a realy good idea, but the fact that TGC randomly started on it and at the time, seemingly abandoned AppGameKit which had just launched half a year earlier was the problem.

Say ONE stupid thing and it ends up as a forum signature forever. - Neuro Fuzzy
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 01:25
For example the Freedom Engine.
Correct me if i'm wrong....
It is based on HTML5 right?

Long life to Steve!
apocolyp4
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 02:42
Quote: "Is impossible to do a cross platform engine with iOS, except if you include only 2D. (3D is incomplete, so for me AppGameKit have no 3D)."


That's not true 108 has 3D and is cross platform with IOS. Ive ran 3D projects that have run on IOS, Android, Blackberry 10 and the Ouya with no issues. Ive no idea why you keep mentioning 3D as it doesn't effect anything you do. If you dont want to use 3D then dont call any 3D functions.

Apple Framework wont be much of an issue for AGK. Apple Framework ties you down with only IOS while AppGameKit is cross platform. Given a choice most developers will choose cross platform.
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 05:17
Apocolyp4 believe me, is impossible (for Extras).

Do you use AudioUnits, MediaPlayer, AVFoundation?
Do you use Push notifications?
Do you use Game Center Multiplayer?
Do you use Facebook completely?
Do you use In Apps in all their methods?
Do you use iAD?
Do you use CALayers and Context for painting?
Have you ever pushed a UIView under the AppGameKit View?

And much other...

I bet you use only the AppGameKit functions, and the AppGameKit EditBox instead UITextField, i'm right?

Yes they are ok, but will be a time you need to use OBJ C, and when you will use it, you will understand what i mean.

Long life to Steve!
baxslash
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 13:47
Quote: "Apocolyp4 believe me, is impossible (for Extras)."

True, for some extras. "Squashies World" needed different code for different platforms but I only called device specific code for adverts, IAP etc and this worked fine for iOS, Android, Blackberry and Windows.

That was a Tier 1 app using one set of source code, as was "Hide It Find It" (on iOS and Android).

Not impossible or tricky, you just have to consider and allow for it using "getDeviceName" as the basis for which code runs.

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
fog
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 14:15
@xGEKKOx

It sounds like you might be using the wrong tool for the job.

People use AppGameKit because it makes multi-platform releases easier and the few that use it just for iOS do so because they don't want to mess with obj-C.

You're trying to use AppGameKit in a way that it was never designed for and in a way all other users are actively trying to avoid.

Trying to look at this more positively...

Why not ask about adding some of what you currently do in obj-c as features to AppGameKit then you won't need to mix the two?

baxslash
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 14:34
What xGEKKOx is asking for here is a version that has NONE of the platform specific tools so that it has the smallest possible impact on his project and doesn't clash with him using those tools without the help of AGK.

I can understand that but it's a big request and he's the only person asking for it (so far). The more I consider it though the more I like it.

Actually what he is asking for is the essence of AGK. If there was a version of AppGameKit with JUST the cross platform commands it would make for a much smaller toolset but perhaps a more useful one.

In my opinion it could perform a pretty handy function in itself as a "Lite", cheap maybe even free version of AppGameKit This might draw in more developers, those who want the platform specific tools could purchase a full license. It's a popular model, look at Unity for example. Perhaps the Lite version could be without 3D or at least without 3D physics...

Just an idea

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
JimHawkins
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 15:20
That's a valid view - but it could well cause a lot of version fragmentation. I'd suggest making that T2 or Pascal only.

-- Jim DO IT FASTER, EASIER AND BETTER WITH AppGameKit FOR PASCAL
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 16:04
- baxslashe : Exactly!!! This is a great idea for marketing and for developers (Tier 2).

- JimHawkins : It need only 2 Version. But as baxslash said, it will sell more, really more.

- fog: if you want to develop serious app on iOS you need to use OBJ C, or you will find a limit very soon.

Long life to Steve!
baxslash
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 16:37
Quote: "but it could well cause a lot of version fragmentation"

There already is the "full" version, a "Lite" version and a demo version of AGK. This way there would just be 2, "full" and "lite". This might mean a whole bunch of users just use the lite version but if it increases the number of users enough it could really break into a much larger market.

Of course it might mean making a lite version of each interpreter but I doubt it, the interpreters only translate the bytecode which would only contain commands that would be in both T1 versions anyway.

Quote: "if you want to develop serious app on iOS you need to use OBJ C, or you will find a limit very soon"

Again I disagree with you here, are you suggesting that the apps everyone has made in Tier 1 are not as "serious" as your own? That makes me feel a little offended

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
Paul Johnston
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 17:22
Quote: "Yes they are ok, but will be a time you need to use OBJ C, and when you will use it, you will understand what i mean."


What issues are having with Obj-C and AppGameKit exactly? The lite version in 108 has no social commands, no push notifications, no game center, and as I mentioned before you can even leave out the AdMob lib. That leaves the lite version needing no third party libs, only Apple ones.

If you are receiving errors or rejections from Apple, please let me know the details and I'll take a look.
Santman
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Posted: 14th Aug 2013 18:33
I kind of agree with both fog and baxslash, but I see you're point. People use agk for the portability, and also because we're not all c+ geniuses and a lot of the hardware work is done by agk. I chose it mainly because I bought the original dark basic years ago on cd.... Despite some of posts, I'm actually a fan.

But I don't think it's fair at all to say you can't do serious apps in tier 1. Could you create candy crush in tier 1? Absolutely. Has it made the developers and millions? Many times over. There is far more to game creation than coding, something many people seem to forget.

But, if agk isn't doing what you need it to do, then I'd Def see that more as a feature request and now is the perfect time to bring it up, and it might be something a good number of other users would want and just not have considered. Maybe a new thread looking for feedback on that one topic, gauge interest and discuss specifics needs as Paul asked?
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 01:24 Edited at: 15th Aug 2013 01:34
- baxslash : no, no. i didn't mean that. I respect al the coders. I mean if you want, for example, do an audio DJ app (serious, not only play/stop), you need AudioUnit, so you need to delegate some things that delegate AVFoundation, so you need to delete the AppGameKit AVAudioDelegate.
Is only an example, i meant "Complex" sorry for the unlucky "serious".
Sorry for my english!


- Paul : Paul i really appreciate your work, you know it. I convinced much peoples to buy AGK.
The problem is not on what now cause error. Is what i will discover in the future AppGameKit will be not compatible with new iOS features i will go to use.
So i don't want to find me in trouble again like with "Street Karate Fighter 2", where i tried for a month to understand where was the problem in facebook, and it was in AppGameKit Facebook + (FacebookSDK Login bug).
It's just a way to keep myself safe in future.
So if nobody use AdMob on iOS, i don't want it in the AGK. For me is an Extra, cause in iOS it doesn't exist, so please put it in the Extras of full version. I think is a logical opinion.
Don't you think?

- santman : Sorry again for my bad english. I try to explain as a Napolitan. We are much colored when we think!!!

Anyway, i don't think i'm a genius, but i always think : "Apple done this thing?? Ok let's use it!!".
I own the PC, not the PC own me, my MAC must do what i want.
As you seen in some tutorials i posted in the past, i mix c++ with Obj C to do the same job in less lines. And it works!!! And i'm really happy of AGK.

The Lite version, as BaxSlash said is a great marketing idea. But need to be clear, without extras.
Do you remember when i read of extras release??? I was really happy. After 1 month i changed my opinion, as on OBJ C, and thanks to Apple frequents update, you sureeeee will found a deprecated function, or something that will delegate in a new different way.

I always code only for the last iOS, to avoid piracy (even if i have my own anti-crack).
96% of Apple users have the last iOS, the rest the 5.1

I want that this point is clear : i love AppGameKit, for me is the best engine, and i tried all the engine there are on the market. AppGameKit is the fastest to use to complete in less time your job.
So, to be fast, and to be always efficient, Extras must be divided from the core.
As i respect the Android coders, you must respect iOS coders, even if i'm the only one.



Long life to Steve!
baxslash
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 10:51
Quote: "So if nobody use AdMob on iOS, i don't want it in the AGK. For me is an Extra, cause in iOS it doesn't exist, so please put it in the Extras of full version. I think is a logical opinion.
Don't you think?"

Quote: "What issues are having with Obj-C and AppGameKit exactly? The lite version in 108 has no social commands, no push notifications, no game center, and as I mentioned before you can even leave out the AdMob lib. That leaves the lite version needing no third party libs, only Apple ones.

If you are receiving errors or rejections from Apple, please let me know the details and I'll take a look."

xGEKKOx, it might help if you tell Paul exactly what the problems you are having are. As he said AdMob can be removed easily. What other exact problems are you having with the current Lite version?

Quote: "Is only an example, i meant "Complex" sorry for the unlucky "serious".
Sorry for my english!"

Still not sure I like the inference but I know you don't mean to be rude. I know how hard it is to say exactly what you mean in another language

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 17:23
Hi Baxslash,
well i don't think it help to tell to Paul what problem i'm having now.
I already avoid all the problems.

But think of the future.
I can't ask to Paul to update every time Apple do a new update.

So the best "Lite" version, for me, and for Paul that must code it, is without any Extras.
I read some of the old post, and i saw that AdMob is hard to divide from the core, can be this the reason AdMob is in the AGKLib?

I also looked at the "IOS Forum"... a desert.
The last post is: "Why the Template don't work on XCode?", guess why?!

Anyway, i hope you understand i didn't want to offend anyone.
I only hope Paul will do a "Lite" version for iOS developers.


Long life to Steve!
baxslash
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 17:36
Quote: "Hi Baxslash,
well i don't think it help to tell to Paul what problem i'm having now.
I already avoid all the problems."

That's great for you but if it could help other users and help Paul fix the problem in future updates then why not share? Seems like you want something fixing but you aren't prepared to tell anyone what it is... I'm sure you can see this is confusing and wasting people's time.

I have been pushing this with TGC to help you (and presumably other people) and was hoping you would be willing to put some effort in to resolve these issues since you've put the effort in complaining about them.

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 19:35 Edited at: 15th Aug 2013 19:36
They are not errors, just to be clear.
Code compile always go fine (with my templates that are completely different).
But i'm afraid there are some delegates in the AGKLib that take the priority on the ones i add outside.

For example :
- On my Audio apps i delete the delegates on audio in the core.m, but i don't know if AppGameKit have some other somewhere!!

- On my apps that use push notifications i delete the delegates and functions on notifications in core.m and i add mines. But i don't know if AppGameKit have some other somewhere?!

- On all my apps i use Facebook, i delete the delegates and push in core., but i don't know if AppGameKit have some other somewhere?!

All examples, and at least, i don't want AdMob in my projects, as i read Apple will reject in future apps with it inside.
I don't want to bother Paul every time Apple will reject something.

Today, my "Break It Out" was rejected again (4th time), and i don't know why!! They say the "In App Purchase" give error. But the code is the same of the other apps.

I only wanna be sure when i receive a rejection, and when i upload an app.
That's all.

Hoping for the future!



Long life to Steve!
Impetus73
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 22:17
What about making a compiler that check the source file for commands used, and only include those in the "player" in tier1 apps, and compiled package in Tier2 apps?

Maybe have a config file, telling the system, what parts to omit?

----------------
AGK programmer
Did Amiga / AMOS programming in the 90's.
fog
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Posted: 15th Aug 2013 22:45
You still haven't explained why you're doing what you're doing.

Let's take an easy example...
Quote: "- On all my apps i use Facebook, i delete the delegates and push in core., but i don't know if AppGameKit have some other somewhere?!"

AGK has some support for Facebook. What are you doing in Obj-C that can't be done currently in AppGameKit? And would that not make a good feature request?

And now you're mentioning removing audio which is core functionality. That doesn't fall in line with what you wanted in a Lite version.

xGEKKOx
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 05:51 Edited at: 16th Aug 2013 06:02
Audio is ok. Never said i wanna cut off audio. The audio is the only thing that don't do conflicts with delegates. I just remove it from the core.m and i'm ok adding it elsewhere.

Well, i prefer to handle delegates with my OBJ C code, as Apple update them much frequently and, obviously, if the main language is OBJ C, and i'm advanced on it, maybe my delegates do some more things, that AppGameKit don't do.

So i don't want some hidden code that "Delegate" for me somewhere, and maybe fire 2 times itself.

All i want is manage the delegates response manually.
With AppGameKit you can't do this, as you receive only 0/1, or true or false or error status.

I only want a 2D engine. Is it so hard to understand??
I repeat....again....
AGK is beautiful on iOS just because you mix c++ with OBJ C!!!!
If this thing ends, AppGameKit on iOS ends.

This is the same reason i said that iOS 7 Sprite Kit, will get AppGameKit V1 die.
And all i wanted to do, is to suggest to TGC to do something before it will be released, as i'm attached to them, as i follow TGC since much years.

AGK, in the begin, was without Extras. Was a 2D engine.
What is it now?

I don't wanna be disagreeable, but i like to discuss with all of you this opinions.

Edit :
Give a look on the AppGameKit MAC/iOS forum, do you think is like the Android one?
Someone can say me why? (after i will give my opinion)

Long life to Steve!
baxslash
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 09:30
Quote: "This is the same reason i said that iOS 7 Sprite Kit, will get AppGameKit V1 die."

I totally disagree, are you saying cocos2d and the other engines will also "die"? Ridiculous.

Quote: "AGK, in the begin, was without Extras. Was a 2D engine.
What is it now?"

It's a cross platform 2D and 3D game development kit, unlike the new "Apple" sprite kit for iOS...

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
Ched80
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 09:53
I have a bug with beta 17 with Win8. I repeatedly get "failed to load mp3 source filter" when trying to playmusic. The file is named correctly and sits in the right location and also plays correctly in media player.

JimHawkins
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 10:14
xGEKKOx - TGC have tried over about 9 months to implement what many people have asked for. If all you want is a sprite engine you could probably have programmed your own in the time it takes you to write all these comments. AppGameKit is a convenient encapsulation of OGL in a systematic cross-platform way.

Seems to me that you want Paul to implement a way for you to override many AppGameKit delegates. That's it.

-- Jim DO IT FASTER, EASIER AND BETTER WITH AppGameKit FOR PASCAL
Santman
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 14:06
I think xgekkox is getting lost in translation. I'm not going to pretend to understand all the technical terms you more accomplished coders are referring to, as I've never touched c, but I think what he wants, essentially, is a "loader" for ios and android in effect, no? Something which can run on the platform, do basic screen set up etc.... Then just run his c coded apps. It's actually a very novel idea. I know that tier 2 can essential do this, but I also see masses of issue posts, but what if that's essentially what a template could do? Just boot up on the target platform, then execute a c program without interference - almost an os within the os and where the bytecode file was just there own c code? I'm not even sure that's possible, or how intricate it would be, but if it suddenly opened the door to c coders to effortlessly deploy to android and ios through agk it might generate quite a few more customers.

Or maybe that's not at all what he means. Lol.

Either way, it sounds like agk just isn't the tool that you want to use - it is primarily a basic tool, and that implies exactly what the name suggests: if I could code c as well as you suggest you do, I probably wouldn't use it myself!
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 17:21 Edited at: 16th Aug 2013 17:36
@BaxSlashes : Yes, baxslashes, cocos 2d is going to die. I read an article where they say that the cocos2d coder was hired from Zynga, and he accepted just because he known of the Sprite Kit by Apple. He looked at it (Sprite Kit) and he said it is great, more than his Cocos2D.

Yes, i know Sprite Kit is not Cross Platform, but 75% of new indie coders choose iOS for the earning.
So i think TGC must don't underestimate iOS.

@JimHawkins : Jim in fact, i already done it. I'm doing this discussion to take (in my opinion) AppGameKit alive on iOS. They are only suggestions to the team.

@Santman : Yes and no.... I think that who don't code for iOS using OBJ C can't understand the power that have AppGameKit (the core part) c++ mixed with iOS.
The Extras, are already present in OBJ C, so why add them again?

So you can answer me : "Gekko is for cross platform"...
I don't want the cross platform, and like me, there are 75% of coders that don't want cross platform.
Or maybe if they will want it, they will find it in AppGameKit 108 "Full Edition".
Just give to customers the possibility to chose, or they will go on Sprite Kit.

AGK could be the best tool for coders (not visual).
For example, i never used a XIB, i always code manually all the button and all the windows.
I code since i was 10 years old, and i never used the visual solution.

Another example:
I done a Windows emulation on iOS, but i never published it because of Apple rules).
Now, with 1076 i used to paint windows with sprites. Now with 108 i use to paint windows with MemBlocks (pixel by pixel). Is faster, i don't need tons of sprites to do a geometric shapes.

Look this image:


I done the Mandelbrot fractal with MemBlocks, and it is immediate in the calculation and painting.
I'm very happy of what TGC has done.
But iOS coders don't need Extras and AdMob!

Oh, and Yes, i get lost in translation much times!!!!!

Long life to Steve!
apocolyp4
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 18:09
xGEKKOx cocos2d and more importantly cocos2d-x wont die because of Apple Sprite Kit. It is open source so even if someone did jump ship to Zynga it will live on. Look at XNA for example. Microsoft killed that but the open source version MonoGame lives on and keeps getting stronger.

Apple Sprite Kit does look good but its only for Apple products so its no use to cross-platform developers. Since it isn't cross-platform then it is not a direct competitor to the AppGameKit like Unity is. The AppGameKit is for developing games/apps that can be deployed on multiple platforms without the hassle of porting from one native API to an other.
swissolo
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 18:30
Quote: "I done the Mandelbrot fractal with MemBlocks, and it is immediate in the calculation and painting.
I'm very happy of what TGC has done."

What? It is? I wrote one using memblocks but it takes about 10 seconds to calculate Care to share?

I'd also still like to know exactly what UDT issue has been fixed. There are a few that have been mentioned over time.

xGEKKOx
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Posted: 16th Aug 2013 18:35 Edited at: 16th Aug 2013 18:39
@swissolo : 0.45 sec to calculate and paint (1024x768) on ipad with pinch to zoom and recalculation after it

Yes, i agree.
But is not me that want bad things happen, is the marketing.
Everywhere i read on internet about iOS VS Android, Apple win in earning, and Android in free downloads.
I never seen a man living of free downloads, or a man that pay meat and bread in the supermarket with free downloads.
So cross platform for iOS is useless at the moment.

So we can say V1 can be divided in "Lite" and "Full".
Maybe in future, iOS and Android will reach the same 50% and the cross platform will be needed.
And TGC will be ready with the V2.

Don't you think a way in the middle can be a solution, only on V1?

Long life to Steve!
swissolo
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Posted: 17th Aug 2013 01:06
Quote: "0.45 sec to calculate and paint (1024x768) on ipad with pinch to zoom and recalculation after it"

how many iterations? How exactly does pinch zoom function? (as it isn't fully real time)

Santman
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Posted: 17th Aug 2013 01:58
xgekkox, this took me about 6 seconds to find. Although it is probably as unreliable as any other source on the internet, you should read it as it raises some important issues too:

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/aug/01/android-apple-google-play-apps

I suspect that it's fair to say that android apps are generally less expensive than google play apps, but it can also be argued that this is directly down to the apps themselves, and the quality of them. Android, in my opinion, is quite saturated with less than stellar apps and you very much get out what you put in. Apple apps tend (I believe, correct me if I am wrong) to be more focused on larger budgets primarily due to the fact that the apple market is older and Android was playing catch up. However android device sales have now overtaken apple ones by a good percentage, and the low cost hi powered hardware will only accelerate that. Throw into the mix the wealth of android consoles coming to the four, and I strongly suspect that the android market will very rapidly "grow up" and the possible extension into more console styled gaming will likely lead to far more advanced, and therefore expensive, games. Food for thought.

On a side note, do you have a link to your apps? I would love to see them.
xGEKKOx
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Posted: 17th Aug 2013 03:14 Edited at: 17th Aug 2013 03:19
@Swissolo : The iterations (a present for you):

Anyway with a pre-fixed int 512 iteration "Render finished in 0.884049"

Well i didn't stopped myself reading 1 article. I spend about 3 hours a day reading of marketing and news and comparison between Android and iOS, to be always ready to change.
I like to be informed on everything, and i like to know also the counterpart.

I understand what you read, but, if you search more, hmmmm, imagine to search 100 articles, you will found 75/100 of them saying what i written.

Apple bet on the app quality, this is why Apple earn more from apps.
Android accept also apps like the "fart button".... hmmmm so i think the 900000 Android apps are in reality 200000.

In my opinion, if iWatch, iPhone C, Joypad controller, iTV (already on the market) and the other products that will come out will have a good marketing, Android will lose much.
When you buy an Apple device (i know it cost too much) you get what you want.
When you get an Android phone, you get the confusion, and usually it don't do what you want. You need to download apps.

I can't resist seeing the dashboard in this way :
Icon_and_widget_x = agk::Random(0,1024);
Icon_and_widget_y = agk::Random(0,768);

I go crazy after 5 min on Android .

Another opinion of mine, is on the console and gaming.
If you wanna play a 3D game, you get your console and carry it with you on holiday.
You will never play a 3D game on a phone, damn, there is no space for buttons!!!!

So you will play your 2D game on the phone, when you will be in the bathroom, in the bus station, in the bus, waiting for something, etc. Only few minutes....

So console and phone are very different things.

I think the Android market will rapidly go down, too fragmentation, too different devices, only 5% use the new Android, piracy, cracks, you can copy apps, users don't do updates.....
It can grow up as open source, but can't earn.

Well, in the end, i wish all of you sell apps, i want the indie developer job grow up, as i want our category become the future.

My apps are in the showcase, and you can find them all on Apple Store using my name.
My apps are not the maximum, as the most of time i do them alone, but hiring new staff i can start big projects now, and what i done till now will help us to spend time to complete bigger projects without taking care of earnings. They will come automatically for the time we just need.

We started for example :
- Last Ninja Mmorpg (new)
- GG Superstar Soccer 2014 (the one i started last year)
- There can only be one (The Barbarian C64 remake)
- Face Place (a social to find girls and boys)

And i included AppGameKit already in them.... Go AppGameKit go!!!!!

Long life to Steve!
Alien Menace
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Posted: 17th Aug 2013 05:05
Quote: "
I have to say that what you've posted means nothing to me. No company will indefinitely support a product that is not making any money. NO company.

Do you complain to Microsoft that Windows 98 is no longer supported? That came out around the same time as DB I believe... how many developers do they have?
"


I see your point but I think where your logic fails in this particular argument is that TGC is still actively selling these products...

Apps published: 3
baxslash
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Posted: 17th Aug 2013 10:24
Quote: "I see your point but I think where your logic fails in this particular argument is that TGC is still actively selling these products..."

I see what you mean, maybe the wrong analogy to use. Those products still work, without updates. If they stop working (as they did when there was the W7 problem) they will either be fixed, shelved or sold with a warning I imagine. Last time DBPro was fixed...

Complaining about the frequency of updates on a product is fair enough but not when those products work perfectly well and are becoming uncompetitive. The market is changing and so is TGC.

"Here I am trying to do some good for the world..." - Fluffy Rabbit
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 17th Aug 2013 12:50
Quote: "Complaining about the frequency of updates on a product is fair enough but not when those products work perfectly well and are becoming uncompetitive. The market is changing and so is TGC."


I just hope that TGC have learned that cheap products and free updates does not pay for dev time. For AppGameKit to continue to improve there needs to be a continuous stream of revenue. v2 is heading in the right direction.

Ancient Lady
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Posted: 20th Aug 2013 22:52
Hi Paul!

I just tested the EditBox in iOS for v10817. Almost there. The shift key works properly and you can move the input point.

However, when you change the input point, the first character typed gets put at the end of the string. The next characters appear in the correct place.

Unfortunately, I do not have any iOS 5.0 device to test on. So my test is done on iOS 6.0 devices.

Cheers,
Ancient Lady
AGK Community Tester and AppGameKit Master
Paul Johnston
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Posted: 21st Aug 2013 00:51
Quote: " when you change the input point, the first character typed gets put at the end of the string."


Literally just as I was about to uploaded beta 18 I saw your post and went back to test it, and lo and behold fixing the shift key broke the cursor. How I didn't spot that when testing the shift key I'll never know, I'll fix it for beta 18 and then upload.
Ancient Lady
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Posted: 21st Aug 2013 01:54
Thank you Paul.

You really do rock!

Cheers,
Ancient Lady
AGK Community Tester and AppGameKit Master

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