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Work in Progress / Project: DarkTOPIA - DarkLINK

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 9th Sep 2004 10:07
its hard to say - technically it will never be done, but we should have something in place where you can go and hang out as you please over the next couple weeks (hopefully)


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 9th Sep 2004 10:23
@Exeat, thanks mate. Anything at all would be great. It can't be any worse than what I would produce myself. And, remember, I would be eternally grateful.

@Cattle, I understand you want to keep the amount of data interchange down. Might one "cheap fix" be to get the server to coordinate the data only every 3 minutes or so? So it basically overrides what all the local clients think are the positions of the avatars with what it thinks are their positions?

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 9th Sep 2004 11:13
Yes that thought has crossed my mind but until I found out why this is happening I become like a terminator, not resting until I destroy my target, or myself be destroyed. I had a revalation whilst in a transcended state earlier, I may need to stop using move object and use position object instead


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 10th Sep 2004 08:11
Sounds like a good idea to me.

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 10th Sep 2004 08:17
Phil could you share some bear dbp wisdom, what are the benefits/drawbacks of using turn object and move object, vs. an absolute positioning scheme using rotate object/position object ?

thanks for some insight.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 10th Sep 2004 23:00 Edited at: 10th Sep 2004 23:01
Well I think the biggest problem here is the one you are seeing. I don't know whether or not Lee's DBPro compiler cleans up the rotation matricies of each object occasionally (I assume it does) but the problem with turn object and move object is that eventually you are going to see that different client computers have different avatars out of phase with each other. Much better to shift to an absolute positioning system.

In fact with an absolute positioning system you could go one step further and have a feedback loop built in. It would be simplicity itself to check if each avatar is correctly positioned. All you'd need to do is get the vector representing the avatar's directional facing (pick screen centre screen x, centre screen y, 1 for each user). Thats three items of data: an X, a Y and a Z dimension. Then compare that against a master list held by the server. That'd tell each client whether it has its avators positioned correctly.

Three items of data for each avatar shouldn't be too much data to chuck around I'd hope.

In fact, I forgot that TOPIA runs in what is effectively a 2D plane, namely the X/Z plane. Y is irrelevant because each user can't look up or down. So in fact you'd only need to chuck the X and Z dimensions around. Even less data load on the system.

Cheers

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 10th Sep 2004 23:33
hmm, this is interesting. I think I am going to chuck turn/move and switch to angle/position - thanks

also we have a scheme in place already that could be recalled at any point for checking/repositioning all of the connected clients in relation to the ME session. When you first join DT you get sent a list of any clients that are already logged in, from that your session builds the list of users (gui) and also creates their avatar objects and assigns the objects their ID's (server assigned). Once the newly connected client has a concept of all of the other clients it loops thru them and sends a request to each of them for their position,angle facing, and forward travel data - if any. The previous clients update the new client with their info, and the new client applies the data to his array representation of the remote clients. At this point the main loop is hit and any remote client will begin getting processed byt the local client. It wouldnt be much to recall this process at anytime to resync any out of place clients *but* before I do that I want to try and elim the out of sync situation in the first place I'll see what we get by changing to the abs pos system.

Thanks for the info and advice
CR


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 13th Sep 2004 00:08
Always a pleasure, Cattle.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 01:40
DarkTOPIA: Recoded

Just a quick note to let you guys know whats going on with the project...

-Development continues, the project is not dead
-I have undertaken a massive recoding/facelift of the client to improve the design and functionality externally (at the urging of many of the beta testers), as well as internally code-wise.
-Mnemonix is recoding core parts of the server application which will hopefully be ready for testing soon.

I expect that the next version you see posted for public consumption will be when we open the doors for real

In this vein, I must speak with Philip and Jimmy on irc if and when they can drop by.

Thanks and stay tuned for new developments
TeamTOPIA


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 03:10 Edited at: 18th Sep 2004 03:11
a sneak peek at the new look:




DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 03:20
Oooh, I like it, looking very nice Cattle! Has the control system changed though?

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 03:52
Thanks, I forgot to mention Jimmy is contributing this GUI to the project - so props there, props there. As far as the movement system, no it hasnt changed, its still Point and click but all preset pivots will be done via those arrows you see there on the GUI. All other non preset moves are done as they were before by clicking anywhere on the floor surface.

YAY!



DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 04:36
Hehe, cant wait to see it in action

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 04:52
me either lol - that screen is teh h4x0rz
The currently reworked client has not yet been combined with the new gui, soon however


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
MiR
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 05:15
Wow. DarkTopia is teh 1337. How does the gui handle private messages though?


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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 05:45 Edited at: 18th Sep 2004 05:47
Thanks. As for private messages, the GUI wont, they will be pumped into your regular text message pump, via some yet to be determined server directive...

example:

you type "/PM CattleRustler Hey hows it going?" then press enter
that message is then sent to the server as a private message instead of a regular chat message that everyone sees. When the server gets it the server forwards it to the intended screen name only, regardless of what zone they are located in. The receiver of the message gets it listed in with his regular chat messages, but no one else does.

We havent decided on server directives yet, "/PM nick message" is just an example.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 05:51
Cool
Has the VB interface been ditched totally now? Personally I like the new look better, even if it is 'shopped.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 07:21
Yes (sorry Exeat) that windowed gui was awesome functionality-wise but almost everyone hated the concept from an end-user perspective. That gui was actually written in C++ as a plugin, which is still used in the program for its other functions, but no longer for its gui aspects.

I should have the new version from Jimmy by tonight or tomr.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 07:34
Cool. Yeah the separate window GUI was a pain imho, I just hope the input remains the same now, and not the DBP-like slow input which annoyed me in the first few demos.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 09:15
its all teh Slickz0rz, dont you worry


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Cian Rice
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 09:24
Can't wait for the final release.

Got anime?I do.
Ilya
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 10:02
The input will probably use text and inkey$.
Otherwise, there will be a scancode to charecter converter.

Dave J
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 10:16
Quote: "Yes (sorry Exeat) that windowed gui was awesome functionality-wise but almost everyone hated the concept from an end-user perspective."


Including me, I don't even know why you wanted that in the first place. o_O


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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 12:37
right, I didnt mean to imply that it was your design idea, it was mine. Blame me all. Anyway, development continues...


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Dave J
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 13:22
Lol, what are you blaming anyone for anyway?


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The Videogameaholic
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 13:58
Looks like it's coming along nicely. Keep up the good work, guys.

RMPVG (Real Men Play Video Games)
CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Sep 2004 23:54
Quote: "Lol, what are you blaming anyone for anyway?"


I am blaming ME for that bad design idea, thats all


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Mattman
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Posted: 19th Sep 2004 01:31
I'd like to test if there ever is one (mattman91@gmail.com)

[url='http://www.ufanz.com/teams/tracking.asp?ti=689&mi=97723][/url]
Kentaree
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Posted: 19th Sep 2004 01:36
There you hear it ladies and gentlemen, it's all CattleRustler's fault!

Quote: "The input will probably use text and inkey$."


I think it'd more likely use the entry buffer, entry$, as this is handled by windows, allowing for better speeds.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 19th Sep 2004 03:17
correct Kentaree, Jimmy can explain.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 19th Sep 2004 09:13
teh Jimmy,

WTF happened?


hope all is well
CR


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Dave J
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Posted: 19th Sep 2004 13:23
Quote: "I am blaming ME for that bad design idea, thats all "


Lol, it's not a bad design, it's just not suited that well to an immersive, 3D world. It'd probably be better for just a plain IRC chat or something like that.


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CattleRustler
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Posted: 19th Sep 2004 23:48
true
from now on I blame everything on --->




DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 21st Sep 2004 04:12
Thats my policy as well.

I've spent the weekend in Berlin on one of my firm's annual junkets. I'm back now. Cattle, when we are next in IRC lets talk about whatever it is you want to talk to me about. I'm guessing: vectors.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 21st Sep 2004 04:21
you guess correct.

If you saw the screenies with the new gui, you can probably deduce the question as well...


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 21st Sep 2004 22:17
... and I answered it in less than 30 seconds. Thats quality vector question answering skills on display there Mr. Cattle.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Philip
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 08:06
No pressure Mr. Cattle but ...

GET ON WITH THIS!!

*LOL*

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Ilya
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 08:07
I think he got bored with it.

CattleRustler
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 08:32
no, not bored at all. Just stuck with some stuff.

_I am giving Jimmy a couple more days with his gui and if its still a no go then we go elsewhere (sorry Jimbo, I am loyal to a fault but this has gotten ridiculous)

_Mnem mentioned something about needing to recode the server. I dont know where that stands. If it does take place then that will add to the work that needs to be done on the client.

I will try and provide more info soon


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Ilya
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 09:00
I made a texture of a metal bumpy thing.

Wiggett
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 09:54
damn i missed out on the beta, ohwell, if you want any of my hq models like furniture and stuff i've made a few pieces, like the table and the torch that goes on a wall etc. you're welcome to have them, oh I even have a beer mug.



so yeha if you want them just ask and i'll put them into .x format or 3ds which ever you want. my email is rwiggett@bigpond.net.au so sign me up for the next beta

The dude guy
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 11:04
Me too!

andrewtamalunas@yahoo.com

Here's my forums www.andrewtamalunas.proboards28.com . Please join!
Ilya
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Cattle said that in the next beta, you sign up.

The dude guy
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Where?

Here's my forums www.andrewtamalunas.proboards28.com . Please join!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 10:36
when its ready there will be a web registration page for DT - may be a little while though.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Wiggett
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 10:46
cool, yell out if you want any custom made models cause im sorta stuck at a bulb?> with my hq modelling.

Dave J
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 22:49
Btw, do you need me to do anything with any of the DLL's CR? Because just say so and I'll get on it ASAP, I just want to make sure I'm not holding you up with anything.


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CattleRustler
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 23:13
Ex,

no, not atm. But I think Mnem is going to need something done with the WS dll involving encryption. I asked him to contact you.


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Philip
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Posted: 9th Oct 2004 08:35
Jimmy is the present hold up. He's not quite finished the GUI yet.

GUI? I hate GUI. GUI is stupid!

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
MikeS
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Posted: 9th Oct 2004 09:25
Who said GUI? You said GUI? GUI makes me mad! GUI is stupid!



A book? I hate book. Book is stupid.
(Formerly known as Yellow)

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