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Geek Culture / DBP code : English or American?

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Dazzag
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 18:31
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Quote: "nos da!"
Not yet mate, far too early. Especially when you sent it... Mochyn saesneg....

Also look up "ty" (with a ^ above the Y) and "tan" along with those words above to get an idea why buying a holiday home in Wales is a bad idea. But only for your "type".... mmmm...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Dazzag
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 18:39
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Quote: "The International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry (IUPAC) adopted aluminium as the standard international name for the element in 1990, but three years later recognised aluminum as an acceptable variant. Hence their periodic table includes both, but places aluminium first [5]. IUPAC officially prefers the use of aluminium in its internal publications, although several IUPAC publications use the spelling aluminum.[6]"
Looked it up on Wikipedia. Interestingly I did a 3 week work effort at college, back around 1990, at a big Aluminium factory. We went into this like *huge* hanger of a place that had literally sand dunes of Aluminium powder (which becomes Aluminium we know). I'm sure he said that was called Aluminum (said in the funny Eye-Raq kind of way) powder, which created Aluminium. Dunno, was a long time ago.

Am sure though that they only got to about 100 words before dropping it. ie. the whole language (millions of words) was not converted, just a small subset that seemed like a good idea (before they got bored) at the time.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Benjamin
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 19:11
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Quote: " I'm dyslexic so I'm allowed to make jokes about it."

Dyslexics of the world untie!

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Deth Wish
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 19:45
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wooo hooo... my first topic going hot

Quote: "dangerous being both dyslexic and alcoholic, you can't even drink soft drinks incase you choke on your own Vimto."

please excuse my ignorance...but why is that again?

Quote: "Runs away from the tomato throwers, into the distance, singing* Old Mac Donald was dyslexic, AOEOI"


dunno why, but when read that, ii pictured a guy, in nothing but man panties, covered in mud skipping off, saying that. (think it was from family guy)

Try playing doom 3 on a laptop....
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Me!
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 20:27
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strange to say but the American language still seems to be diverging from the rest of the world despite the internet and global communication/companies that you would expect to even out the differences, like that new Americanised pronunciation of nuclear...neywkiller, whats with that?, they where using the correct form a few years back, now people keep saying "neywkiller terrorist threat" on CNN , judging from the context they don`t mean people they never previously considered capable of murder, they mean as in atomic or radiological weapons, and that seriously strained pronunciation of vehicle, in the UK Veakl or Vekul, maybe with a very soft H thrown in, in the US they say Vee-Hee-High-Kull (or as near as I can Phoneticise it), it realy sounds strained and artificial when you hear it , I do wonder why American English continues to diverge from even their own norm, like I say, you would expect it would become more standardised, next they will be using teh for the .



Do parachute manufacturers have a refunds policy?
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 21:11
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"please excuse my ignorance...but why is that again?"
Drunks choke on their own VOMIT, VIMTO is a soft drink similar to ribena

"dunno why, but when read that, ii pictured a guy, in nothing but man panties, covered in mud skipping off, saying that. (think it was from family guy)"
Lol well if by "panties" you mean "fully clothed in mens clothes", and by "skipping" you mean sitting bored at a office chair, you'd be right

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David T
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 21:12
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Quote: "Quote: "nos da!"
Not yet mate, far too early. Especially when you sent it... Mochyn saesneg....

Also look up "ty" (with a ^ above the Y) and "tan" along with those words above to get an idea why buying a holiday home in Wales is a bad idea. But only for your "type".... mmmm... "


Ty with a hat is a house, the is like a roof

One of my friends told me how to say my name is in Welsh today. I've forgotten what she said, again. She also told me about some famous set of Welsh stories involving giants with beards.

The perils of Welsh Literature GCSE....

Nos da!

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
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Benjamin
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 21:15
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Welsh landwich. Lern it.

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Killswitch
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 21:22
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I've just come back from a field trip in Wales. There was a place with a Welsh name that meant 'Three Cocks' in English.



Honestly, those chickens are spoilt out there.

~It's a common mistake to make, the rules of the English langauge do not apply to insanity~
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Dazzag
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 23:48
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Quote: "Nos da!"
Now is about right....

Quote: "One of my friends told me how to say my name is in Welsh today"
Well there are a few for David. But the only one I can remember (and the more famous one) is Dafydd. But you say it "Davive". Hmmm. More like "Daviithhh". Hard to pronounce in English words.... Did you know the dd is a single letter in the Welsh language? Same as ll (sounds like cchhhhhh sort of, but while sort of gargling and ready to spit...). Saying that, my dad is David (and Welsh), but he was *never* Dafydd.

Giants with beards Grief, all we had in GCSEs was massively biased history again the hated english....

Quote: "strange to say but the American language still seems to be diverging from the rest of the world"
Doubt it. Now, more than ever, we get most of our TV programs from the US (not too suprising since 5 times more people in the US than the UK, and they speak our language). So not likely to drift too far away from us, apart from stupid yokel stuff that probably won't get out of the state anyway. And if it did then we would pick it up too, cos it would spread because of TV, Music, and the Net which we see too. And if it never gets here, then probably isn't popular, and would bet didn't really cover the whole of the US.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Dazzag
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Posted: 24th Nov 2005 23:51
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Actually that reminds me. I once knew an English guy in Uni called Bryn. He was a small little loser who was always told by his Welsh parents that his name was "Mountain" in welsh. Heh. Told him it was actually "Hill" (which it is). Totally flipped out on me (where has Ninja Navy Seal thread bloke gone??) and he quit Uni the month after (might not have anything to do with it mind, but was amusing). Gotta laugh

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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David T
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 00:14
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Quote: "Well there are a few for David. But the only one I can remember (and the more famous one) is Dafydd. But you say it "Davive". Hmmm. More like "Daviithhh". Hard to pronounce in English words.... Did you know the dd is a single letter in the Welsh language? Same as ll (sounds like cchhhhhh sort of, but while sort of gargling and ready to spit...). Saying that, my dad is David (and Welsh), but he was *never* Dafydd. "


IIRC in the actual sentence itself there's a lot of "euq" sounds. Was something like

Iy Eu Euwch (something) David

can't remember. Will ask again tomorrow. Some day I'll learn it.

Quote: "Actually that reminds me. I once knew an English guy in Uni called Bryn. He was a small little loser who was always told by his Welsh parents that his name was "Mountain" in welsh. Heh. Told him it was actually "Hill" (which it is). Totally flipped out on me (where has Ninja Navy Seal thread bloke gone??) and he quit Uni the month after (might not have anything to do with it mind, but was amusing). Gotta laugh"


You've told that story before Very funny!

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
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Tinkergirl
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 12:16
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I think the Welsh 'dd' is pronounced the same way as the 'ch' in loch in Scottish

And no - it's not 'lock'.
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 14:09
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Quote: "But I can also understand why it might be PLAIN, b/c a plane is a thing that flies, and plain is just well, without noticable features. So like if you had MAKE OBJECT PLANE, you might think you were about to create a jet or fighter, but MAKE OBJECT PLAIN, you might think you are modifying an object already created so that it's uninteresting. Like if you had Strawberry Rocky-Road ice cream object, and you said MAKE OBJECT PLAIN it would convert it into just vanilla ice cream. And that leads me to the question: "Where is the MAKE OBJECT SPECTACULAR command?". Like if you had a 12 polygon cube object, you could use the MAKE OBJECT SPECTACULAR on it and get a 4k poly animated gladiator model on a chariot."


And maybe the MAKE OBJECT BOX should be spelt MAKE OBJECT BOCKS because otherwise the user might be expecting their object to don a pair of padded gloves and take on Mike Tyson. I'm guessing PLAIN was a spelling mistake in the first place.

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 17:32
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Quote: "It's "Colour" and "Honour" all the way for us Canadians."
Sorry, but it should be written like this:
<<It's "Colour" and "Honour" all the way for us ANGLOPHONE Canadians.>>

Us francophones are too busy fighting over if "le fun" is french or not(which it isn't).

[center]It's amazing how much TV has raised us. (Bart Simpson)

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Jeku
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 18:42
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Are you *actually* a francophone or just a poser? You live in Winnipeg, which last I heard consisted of a majority of English speakers.

My grandma is French-Canadian but that doesn't make me a francophone.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 19:21
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Quote: "I think the Welsh 'dd' is pronounced the same way as the 'ch' in loch in Scottish "
Nope. I think 'ch' sounds similar to the *single* letter 'ch' in welsh. Hard to explain to English speaking people as it sounds correct to me to say it sounds like chhhh. But not when I think about it in English. Comes from the back of your throat basically. The single letter 'dd' in welsh would make "loch" sound nothing like what I've heard Scottish people say it like. Would sound more like... bugger... not easy to spell how it would sound.... erm... similar to "loth" perhaps, but with lower sound to the "th"... erm... no.... but not like scottish say "loch".

Quote: "You've told that story before Very funny!"
Rats, it's come full circle. I am now like the BBC - full of repeats. Plus get voted off the board by millions of crazed chavs every week. Hmmm. Now theres an idea. A DB big brother....

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Manticore Night
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 21:29 Edited at: 25th Nov 2005 21:47
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Quote: "Are you *actually* a francophone or just a poser? You live in Winnipeg, which last I heard consisted of a majority of English speakers."
Acctually it's the closest place to were I came from that acctually has toilets(ok, La Brocherie probably does have toilets, but I assume things when there's no were tasty to eat in the general area). But as far I'm conserned Québec is not the only place were there are franco-canadiens. Infact I think that all the french-canadians live OUTSIDE of Québec beacause Québecois all [GROSSLY INACURATE GENERALIZATION ALERT]speak silly sounding french(like <<le fun>>

I'm francomanitobain and proud of it, it's like g@y pride except your straight ,and don't go to those nasty g@ybars. In fact I'm making a game about Voyageurs(which is the closest you could get to franco-manitobain history, that still involves killing things).

Anyway in all seriousness, have you ever been to the south of winnipeg, it's full of francophones. It's like a small Québec with whinny Anglophones and all!(PS. I hope noone was offended by that).

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 21:49
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Hopw noone minds this sig, test, just didn't want to waste too much space, delete this post if you want.

[center]It's amazing how much TV has raised us. (Bart Simpson)

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 21:50
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oops this should work

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Jeku
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Posted: 25th Nov 2005 22:09
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Ouch, that's way too big Manticore. The limit is 600x120...

Sadly I've never even been to Manitoba. I've driven as far east as Saskatchewan, and flown to Ontario. But that's it :-(

Hopefully soon I'll be moving to Montreal--- as long as the game company hires me that is

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blanky
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Posted: 27th Nov 2005 02:25
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@Manticore: Heh, nice to see ya back. Did you make Vince the Vet 2? I loved that xD

@Someone else who I can't remember: The welsh sound 'dd' is pronounced like 'thh', only instead of a soft thh it's a harsh 'th' sound. Like wthe beginning of when you say 'the'.

Try saying Caerdydd. Go on, record yourselves and I'll laugh at you.

(was born in Wales )

16-colour PNGs pwn.
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Manticore Night
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Posted: 27th Nov 2005 22:30
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Quote: "@Manticore: Heh, nice to see ya back. Did you make Vince the Vet 2? I loved that xD"
Thanks, nice to be back. I've been perfecting Vince(I got a new death screen for fluffy the cat, it has Vinces severed head in Fluffys food dish). I'm taking a break to make a game about french people. But I'm still fixing up Vince when I get insprired(Planning to add the most retarded audio settings ever). But my site is down(I stopped paying bills for a while). So don't expect much as far as demos soon.

Is Ben and That cat guy still around?

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Benjamin
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Posted: 27th Nov 2005 22:40
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Good to see you again Manticore!

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David T
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 00:15
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Quote: "Try saying Caerdydd. Go on, record yourselves and I'll laugh at you."


I'm going to take a gamble and say it sounds something like

cardiff

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 01:43
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Well, what I don't understand is why Americans changed the English language over there, only causes confusion.
Lets see how many AMERICANS, know what a Gaol is, in its original UK spelling, sorry for caps, but meh!

Anyway, I think it might be because most programming apps use the American dialect, and well lets say when switching to another language and you are typing, it'll only cause confusion with Colour and Color, and you'd keep getting syntaxes and drive you up the wall, although and english app, but I can't believe I'm saying this, makes things easier being american.

Your signature has been erased by a mod because it's larger than 600x120...
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Dazzag
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 09:19
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Quote: "Try saying Caerdydd"
Man, that is practically England. Southern Welsh scum Dunno about the hard "thh" though. Suppose so. But still not quite right. Weird how cannot quite say how it sounds. Someone record it.

Quote: "it'll only cause confusion with Colour and Color"
Exactly. Although I think after a while it's nothing to do with Americanising English, and you associate it with computer languages. So to change a colour is always COLOR (if that command is used). Not thinking it's american, just thinking it's the usual way to do things in computer languages. I mean CLS isn't even a real word, but everyone knows it means clear screen.

Quote: "Well, what I don't understand is why Americans changed the English language"
To stick it to the limeys is my guess. What better way to rebel against your parents? That or the man behind the scenes was a printer who could see the saving (in ink) of the odd letter here and there Corruption I tell ye...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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TDK
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 17:32
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Quote: "Well, what I don't understand is why Americans changed the English language"


I've no idea whether or not it's true, but my theory is that the first settlers of the 'New World' from the UK were probably poor, uneducated labourers who couldn't read and write.

They were most likely taught to read and write by others only marginally more educated, using spelling which was easier to understand - hence the shortening of some words by removing letters which weren't really necessary or were confusing.

Hence colour became color, grey became gray and so on.

Though I have to admit that this theory falls over when you wonder why the Americans use the French-derived word 'faucet' when we use tap!

Let's face it, there are a lot of words in the (UK) English dictionary which are spelled oddly in comparison to how they are pronounced. Near where I used to live in in the UK, there was a village called Cholmondley. How is it pronounced? Chumley!

I have a good grasp of English, (I never use a spellchecker), and even I can't see the point of 'silent letters'. (Apparently, something like 60% of English words have them and almost every letter of the alphabet is silent in at least one word)!

So what is the b at the end of the word comb for, or the k at the start of knife and knight?

Obviously, over the ages, English has borrowed words from other languages and these letters were probably present in the foreign word, but the English didn't have an equivalent sound to pronounce them.

The English alphabet has 26 letters to represent around 40 different sounds so two or more letters are combined to represent the other sounds. Some languages simply add extra letters to their alphabet like Russian which has 33.

Also, in olde English, some words were actually pronounced the same as they are spelled. Over time, the way they are pronounced has changed, but the spelling hasn't.

So, in DB it makes sense to stick to the standard programming language convention of using COLOR instead of COLOUR, but I do agree with those of you who say that PLAIN should be PLANE and it was an error on Lee's part on that one.

I've waffled enough I think...

TDK_Man

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TKF15H
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 18:31
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Quote: "I've no idea whether or not it's true, but my theory is that the first settlers of the 'New World' from the UK were probably poor, uneducated labourers who couldn't read and write."

Well, from what I read, it was changed deliberatly by Benjamin Franklin and some other dude. They wrote their own dictionaries with tonnes of weird spellings, but only a few of their words got wide-spread.

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Jeku
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 20:26
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They changed it deliberately to separate themselves from the old world.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 28th Nov 2005 20:57 Edited at: 28th Nov 2005 20:57
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Quote: "I've no idea whether or not it's true, but my theory is that the first settlers of the 'New World' from the UK were probably poor, uneducated labourers who couldn't read and write."
Think they were a load of religious zealots. Can't remember. Not as if we are taught it in history or anything (not in Wales). But doubt they were stupid if so (unlike down under where they were crims )

Quote: "They were most likely taught to read and write by others only marginally more educated, using spelling which was easier to understand - hence the shortening of some words by removing letters which weren't really necessary or were confusing."
Others? Who could speak English? Marginally more educated in English, than, erm, the English?

As to comb, if you took away the "b" then it would be "com". This would be pronounced as it looks. ie. like a web page com. Comb on the other hand sounds completely different. Changing it to an "e" makes "Come", which again sounds completely different. Bad example that one. Knife is a good one as it is completely silent (ie. useless "K"). Perhaps sounded different oodles of years ago. Although thats a good example. Is it spelt "nife" in the US? I don't believe it does (think its only about 100 words out of millions). But why not? Obvious one to carry on with after rumour, colour etc. But no, because they couldn't be bothered carrying on basically. Not suprising considering the amazing amount of words in the English language.

Cheers

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David T
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Posted: 29th Nov 2005 09:01
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As I said before, all these things are in Bil Bryson's book Made in America. When I find the relevant section, I'll let you know how each thing got changed

"A book. If u know something why cant u make a kool game or prog.
come on now. A book. I hate books. book is stupid. I know that I need codes but I dont know the codes"
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TDK
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Posted: 29th Nov 2005 15:13
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Quote: "As to comb, if you took away the "b" then it would be "com". This would be pronounced as it looks. ie. like a web page com. Comb on the other hand sounds completely different. Changing it to an "e" makes "Come", which again sounds completely different. Bad example that one."


It's still an example of a word with a letter which isn't pronounced - well not any more at least. It may have been many years ago.

I wasn't suggesting you would remove the b - more a case of pointing out how the 'mb' was paired together to represent a different sound.

The problem is that there doesn't seem to be any consistency to it all. For example mb after o in comb softens the o to 'oh' but mb after a in lamb keeps a 'hard' a, though the b remains silent.

Come is another typical example of an odd English word. That should be pronounced like 'dome' or 'home' only with a c, so why is it pronounced to rhyme with drum?

Strange language, English!

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 29th Nov 2005 17:03 Edited at: 29th Nov 2005 17:03
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Quote: "Strange language, English! "
Damn straight! And always though it was odd that buy to the plural is bought. The only simmalarity is 1 letter. We should all just drop this silly language and talk klingon! Kerpact!

[center]It's amazing how much TV has raised us. (Bart Simpson)

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Deth Wish
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Posted: 1st Dec 2005 09:23
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Quote: "Come ... why is it pronounced to rhyme with drum"

so are you saying we should spell it "cum"

pervert
j/k

Quote: "buy to the plural is bought"

jigga wha??? i didnt know verbs had plurals????

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dark coder
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Posted: 1st Dec 2005 09:52
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believe it or not come is spelled the same in both countries so your not funny, and im sure saying that word is very appropriate here


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Lost in Thought
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Posted: 1st Dec 2005 10:31
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I find it quite aggravating that it has been proven that most intelligent people can read words that have the letters entirely in the wrong order but the first and last letters, and yet people still and make a big to-do complaining when people spell things incorrectly. Languages have been evolving and adapting since the beginning of language. What makes one so much better than the other? Would you be happy if we were all still speaking latin?

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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Location: Somerset / UK
Posted: 1st Dec 2005 18:32
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My wife speaks Latin at me when she wants to annoy me, because I don't understand it...


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Jeku
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 1st Dec 2005 19:56
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My wife speaks Chinese to me when she's angry at me.


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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Location: Somerset / UK
Posted: 1st Dec 2005 20:12
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lol cool, its not just me then


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Manticore Night
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Joined: 23rd Oct 2003
Location: Ouinnipeg
Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 04:59
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Quote: "jigga wha??? i didnt know verbs had plurals????"
Sorry to bump this but. What I meant was buy is sooo different from bought that they don't seem like they should be related, not like french(*everyone rolls eyes*). It's achète, and achèté(I have a feeling I misspelt those but the dicionary is on the other side of the room, and I'm lazy).

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Jeff Miller
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Location: New Jersey, USA
Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 13:16
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And it gets more irritating if you go a few miles south. In Boston it's pronounced "bot" and in New Jersey "bawt". All these irregular verb rules consume too much of your neurological RAM. The colonists should have tried to tackle that problem instead of just fiddling with some minor spelling adjustments.
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empty
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Location: 3 boats down from the candy
Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 16:22 Edited at: 2nd Dec 2005 16:22
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Quote: "Sorry to bump this but. What I meant was buy is sooo different from bought that they don't seem like they should be related, not like french(*everyone rolls eyes*). It's achète, and achèté(I have a feeling I misspelt those but the dicionary is on the other side of the room, and I'm lazy)."

The French language isn't a such a good example for consistancy (eg. avoir? aller? faillir?). However, irregular verbs and complex conjugation rules are known in many languages.


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Manticore Night
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 19:17
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Quote: "The French language isn't a such a good example for consistancy (eg. avoir? aller? faillir?). "
I don't really understand that, but I still respect you for trying. [j/k]

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David T
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 19:35 Edited at: 2nd Dec 2005 21:04
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avoir

j'ai
tu as
il/elle/on a
nous avons
vous avez
ils ont

I think he was getting at the inconsistency there.

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Benjamin
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Location: France
Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 19:43 Edited at: 2nd Dec 2005 19:44
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Quote: "nous allons
vous allez"

These are part of aller, not avoir.

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David T
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 21:04
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Ah, damn. I knew I was on autopilot too much.

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empty
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 21:17
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Quote: "I think he was getting at the inconsistency there."

Indeed, I was.

j'ai (present indicative)
j'eus (past simple indicative)
j'avais (imperfect indicative)
j'aurai (future indicative)
que j'aie (present subjunctive)
que j'eusse (imperfect subjunctive)

ayant (present participle)
eu/eue (past participle)


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Jeku
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 22:12
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And I'm sorry, but a language that makes you memorize every object's masculine or femininity, with no logical way to do it, is just trouble in my books. This might be one of the reasons why I dropped out of French in Grade 9.


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Manticore Night
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Location: Ouinnipeg
Posted: 2nd Dec 2005 23:46 Edited at: 2nd Dec 2005 23:49
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Quote: "And I'm sorry, but a language that makes you memorize every object's masculine or femininity, with no logical way to do it, is just trouble in my books."
It comes pretty easy, just say the word with unune infront and one will sound funny.

Quote: "
j'eus (past simple indicative)"

darn, ya caught me! I think that might be wrong, but the verb time(is that a word in english?) is in english and my becherelle isn't and I'm too lazy to translate.

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