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Geek Culture / Space Cadets

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Dazzag
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 00:15
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Ah, just attach the air con to the exhaust pipe of someone's car. Tops.

Cheers

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Philip
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 00:25
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Quote: "Hmmm. Can you defraud someone if they're not giving you any money?"


Of course you can. You can defraud people of many things including a loss of opportunity and/or services rendered, etc. etc.

Quote: "And they never signed any contracts about going into space."


Irrelevant. They were promised the opportunity to go into space if they did various exercises and were chosen. A binding contract is not and has never been a pre-requisite to conspiracy to defraud.

Quote: "In fact, they probably signed a disclaimer at the start saying they wont hold CH4 responsible for any blah blah blah. Ch4 would've covered their backsides for sure."


Irrelevant. Its a basic principle of law that you can only validly disclaim when you know exactly what it is that you are disclaiming. Nobody explained to the participants that, contrary to the misrepresentations about the opportunity to go into space, they were actually part of a large televisual hoax in which they were to be publicly humiliated, and asked to disclaim C4's liability for the same.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 00:57
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What if there was a clause that stated something to the effect "You may or may not go into space"


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Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 02:10 Edited at: 15th Dec 2005 02:12
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Whats space cadets about? never heard of it. The worst reality TV show I think I've seen in the US is "My Big Fat Obnoxious Boss", which got cancelled for some reason, i never watched it, so i never knew why. I like a few reality TV shows though, not all are bad, though my favorite shows are mostly the random, non-series, specials on Discovery Channel, and History Channel (if theres enough reanactment and CG reconstructment, like on "shootout", i found that to be very interesting, but not if it a narrator talking about old black and white photographs and soundless footage). Reality TV shows i like:
Mythbusters
Survivor=so so
Amazing Race
American Idol

EDIT: Space cadets sounds like they fake the people taking a space trip, sounds actually a bit entertaining really, but only if they give them an actual space trip afterwards.

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soapyfish
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 03:07 Edited at: 15th Dec 2005 03:12
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Quote: "Whats space cadets about?"


You got it right with

Quote: "Space cadets sounds like they fake the people taking a space trip, sounds actually a bit entertaining really"


But....
Quote: "but only if they give them an actual space trip afterwards"


would cost far too much.

They're somewhere in England (can't remember where, old military base) but channel 4 have decked it out to look like russia and put a big model spaceship in a hanger with a big screen in front of it showing an image of Earth.

To say some of it's live, I'm surprised one of the national newspapers hasn't tried tracking them down and telling them it's fake, they could play it's raining men over loud speakers or something else suitably unsuitable.

I like the little gags they put in, for example that bloke said STAR's (the people they're meant to be training with) motto in either russian or latin and said it translated as "We The Adventurers" when what he said actually meant "It's Not Rocket Science"


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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 10:29
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According to the BBC News picture caption, the contestants were chosen for their suggestibility...

When brain cells were being handed out, these people were probably watching paint dry.

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Van B
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 10:45
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What struck me yesterday when Johnny visited the 2 actors was that Johnny was very quiet and whispering, while the 2 actors were yelping like idiots as if it was no secret what was really going on - like they've no reason to be quiet - I'm getting more and more convinced that they're all in on it.


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Chilled Programmer 420
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 11:55 Edited at: 15th Dec 2005 12:05
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ive seen about 10 seonds of this show, i culd see the fakeness a mile off, are they actually buying it?, i am goin to watch the end, lmao, the looks on there faces is gonna be a classic

theres a few things that i cant think how channel4 got around:
1) the g force when entering space
2) the hightech computers and scientist before they took of
3) all the high tech stuff that would be needed to do on bored
4) how the windows(presumablly) will always show the same scene
5) just the overall look and feel of fakeness i about chocked on after watchin the shoe for a whole 10 seconds

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BatVink
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 14:34
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I'm not supporting C4s arguments here, just telling you what they said...

Quote: "1) the g force when entering space"

They tipped the simulator backwards. They were also told it was a horizontal take off, followed by spiralling out the atmosphere.

Quote: "2) the hightech computers and scientist before they took of
3) all the high tech stuff that would be needed to do on bored
"

They have set the whole scenario up in Russia, where technology isn't supposed to be quite like we see NASA represented in films.

Quote: "4) how the windows(presumablly) will always show the same scene"

They have an IMAX cinema screen in front of the simulator, and the windows are shuttered over for a lot of the time. There are no other windows and they cannot go right in to the front of the cockpit.

They do the reveal for the contestants on the ground tonight!!! I think they should do the reveal for the ones in the spaceship whilst they still think they are in space.

Nooo! I'm still being sucked in!

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David T
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 17:39
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Quote: "What if there was a clause that stated something to the effect "You may or may not go into space""


Most likely - only a select few will go to space so a clause like that is very easy to get in.


Quote: "They do the reveal for the contestants on the ground tonight!!! I think they should do the reveal for the ones in the spaceship whilst they still think they are in space. "


They should pretend a hatch blows out. Then instead of their eyes popping and stuff that depressurisation, Johhny Vaughan enters.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 19:32
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Quote: "They should pretend a hatch blows out"
Go back a page. Amusing endings (including that one) have already been discussed.

Quote: "Then instead of their eyes popping and stuff that depressurisation, Johhny Vaughan enters"
Same thing would happen surely? Talentless gimp.....

Hmmm, didn't realise the people on the ground are still clueless. Even better, double the tragedy. So blow the hatch to freak the people out on the "shuttle", and have a simulated shuttle crash for the people on the ground ("Thank god I didn't make it" comments would be class once they see the people aren't dead and it was all recorded on live TV. Yuck yuck...).

Apparently they have a tornado over one of the countries for the "windows". They have some serious effects (better than the Matrix said one of the papers - guess which....) apparently. Still think they should nuke a country or two just to get them into some serious brown trousers. Running out of air is also a goodie (wake up in hell for a new series of "Satan's Cadets"?).

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Tinkergirl
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Posted: 15th Dec 2005 20:41
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A better one:

Just stop all communications. Complete silence. Earth goes quiet.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Hello? Anyone there?
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Philip
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 01:42
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Personally I'm more curious about why you are using Julius Caesar as an avatar. Do you have secret egotistical issues that you'd like to share with us?

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BatVink
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 09:52
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Mmmm...I have "issues" with someone who claims he is a bear and censors any real photos of himself for fear of shattering the illusion that we do, in fact, share this forum with a legitmate jam-eating, hairy mammal, questioning other avatars

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 14:15
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I think the two pilot actors should pass out. See how the others react to being "stuck" in space with nobody to guide the shuttle down


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Tinkergirl
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 16:52
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It's not Julius Caesar
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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 17:08
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Or where aliens come a-visitin'... Especially Alien-type aliens

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Van B
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 17:19
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I'd have the 2 pilots order pizza and then eat it in front of them .


Van-B

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adr
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 17:23
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I would personally fund the entire project if they made facehuggers burst out of both pilots' chests.

Imagine the chaos ... mwuahahahha

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iv tryed everything!!!!!!!!!! could u please just add The gun and shooting Code thats All!!!!!!!!!
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tpfkat
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 18:35
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i reckon the old " huston we have a problem" then watch them fill their mansized nappies.or put up a picture of mars and tell them theyve drifted a bit,all in all this is an excellent show.....a longer better version of game for a laugh.

let me see though...go into space with gravity.
hazel nut cluster??????
no training in bailing out?????????
a race to be the first country to offer space tourism,but they send up foreiners and have foreign instructors??????
gullible just aint the word.and these people will probably get to host a tv show afterwards???????????????????????????????
playschool or andypandy i think.

the programmer formarly known as thicko.
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Fallout
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 22:20
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Best quote in the show so far:

"You've already let a basketball in space! You can't chuck a dustbuster with a dog in it in space too."

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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 22:34
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Makes no sense

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BatVink
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Posted: 16th Dec 2005 23:48
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Anyone else think it was very unpolished? For example, the big reveal involved 4 people taking 5 minutes to push the "pod" to the front of the warehouse, taking the edge off the fact that they had already been told it was a trick.

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Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 17th Dec 2005 01:08
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It was poorly done. The whole training thing was hard to bare. They should have compacted the whole thing into a few days viewing. They could have done some zero G on them as well by dropping the plane from a great height in the finale.

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Fallout
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Posted: 17th Dec 2005 02:08
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I enjoyed it from start to finish. Mind you, I didn't sit down and watch it. I always had it on in the background, so it only had 50% of my attention, but I thought the ending was fine. It was kind of a trade off between shock factor and letting them down slowly.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 17th Dec 2005 02:43
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i think the end was quite tastefull. They wouldn't want to make them feel incredibly stupid because, at the end of the day, they have provided entertainment and they have also won a prize. It is meant as a bit of fun - not to destroy people!!

I love that bit about not putting the dustbuster into space as they've already sent a basketball out there!!


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Fallout
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Posted: 17th Dec 2005 11:19
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lol - yeah. Classic quote. That will be going onto my favourite quote part of my profile in many a website.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 18th Dec 2005 00:38
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Quote: "dropping the plane from a great height"
Yes. They should have done that... It can't fly can it?....

So what exactly did happen then? Didn't watch a second after my last post. Good olde Xmas parties etc

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Philip
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Posted: 18th Dec 2005 23:24
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Colour me unimpressed by the finale. What an utterly annoying and pointless show. £25k for the public humiliation which the contestants suffered is peanuts given the millions that C4 would have made out of the advertising rights.

I hope the contestants now sue C4 and Endemol.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 18th Dec 2005 23:36
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Endemol? Who are they?

It was a pants ending - but then again, if they emotionally truamatise them too much, they might sue

As it is - I think they should see the joke.

I know you're arguing that its wrong to humiliate people like that for entertainment, and normally I would agree with you, but in this case, they were particularly thick...


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Me!
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Posted: 19th Dec 2005 11:55
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that doesn`t make any difference, in fact it`s worse, are you argueing that it would be ok to realy humilate and totaly destroy some genuinly retarded person?, you would think these "intelligent" program makers would have something about them like decency, or honesty, for all the effort and cost they could have put on a genuinley interesting show, in fact I have the perfect idea for one, and it doesn`t make the people taking part look stupid, on the contrary, and it would actualy be interesting, this is just the product of lazy, idle, no conscience executives just trying to chase ratings rather than produce entertainment.



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Fallout
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Posted: 19th Dec 2005 12:14 Edited at: 19th Dec 2005 12:15
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I think it Nicholas is just messing about to be honest! I dont think he has any compassion for the people who were setup, but I think he's just having a laugh saying they should've been totally humiliated! I could be wrong though.

I think you guys need to calm down though. I guess if you were in their shoes, you'd be humiliated, so you feel sorry for them and think what CH4 did was bad. However, I think they'll be embaressed and some harsh people will take the mick out of them for a while. I think most people however will see the funny side, and won't give them a hard time. I personally wouldn't .. I think it's funny, I think they were done, and I don't think they were THAT stupid. We really didn't get to see the month of brainwashing they went through before they get on the sim, so we don't know quite how conditioned they were to believe it.

They've got their £25k each, and there low gravity flight, so they get pretty much the experience they wanted. A few of em will probably get presenter jobs and better short term carears from it. That might get on a few shows too. Most of us will forget them in a few days/weeks, and most of us I think will see the funny side and not think of them as retards.

I dont think it was a bad show. I saw it start to finish. I dont see any harm done.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 19th Dec 2005 14:25
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I would laugh at them simply for the people they are.

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David T
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Posted: 19th Dec 2005 15:22
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They all seemed pretty good sports - just lots of laughing and "oh my god"s

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Philip
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Posted: 19th Dec 2005 21:28 Edited at: 19th Dec 2005 21:31
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I personally regret that anyone could think that exploiting and humiliating people on national TV for commercial gain is in any way appropriate because it is supposedly done for "comic" purposes.

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BatVink
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Posted: 19th Dec 2005 22:05
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Looking at it now, I blame the other reality shows for the apparently disappointing damp squib of a finish. I don't agree with Space Cadets, but they did treat them with a certain degree of respect towards the end, with a gentle let-down.

The sensationalism of the reality TV shows has gone too far. We were all waiting for a big-bang, look what a bunch of buffoons you are, finale. And it's wrong.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 20th Dec 2005 10:33
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@Me!

I'm kinda messing about. Thing is - they weren't retarded in the dictionary definition of the word (ie slow in emotional or physical development), however they are pretty thick/stupid/dumb. They left SO many holes in what they did (C4) that someone in the group should have seen through it. These people clearly have no idea about going into space. Things like the complete lack of serious training. The getting into space by spiraling up - did they not realise that the only reason we use vertical takeoff is because we HAVE to to break free of gravity.

Thats what I have very little sympathy for them. They were just so blinded by the fact they were on TV and getting famous for it. They clearly lost sight of logic. Suppose you could say they were blinded by the stage lights.

I dont like people making fun of genuinely retarded people as they have no choice and its just morally wrong. Please done mistake mefor someone who is that "wrong". I'm not that guy!

I just hate realtity tv which panders to people's attention seeking side to make them look fools in front of millions. Its just a waste of air bandwidth. I think these people deserved what they got in terms of humiliation due to them just being so blind due to their craving for attention in the form of realtity TV.

They were lucky the ended was as "polite" as it was.

I appologise if I have offended anyone, but it is my opinion. I'm not gonna hide it, but if someone can convince me otherwise - thats fine, go for it. I dont accept the exploiting and humiliating people for commercial gain arguement. These people went on that of their own free will. They were not forced - they CHOSE to go on it. And, as I have said, due to them being blinded by TV and attention craving, they lost sight of logic, etc.


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Me!
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Posted: 20th Dec 2005 18:12
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lots of people went on TV in my youth and got what they where promised, the program was run by Jimmy Saville, they called it Jim`ll Fix it!, the fun of the program was in seeing kids get to drive a F1 car or fly a plane etc, something positive and good natured, now, despite society being wealthier, the best we can do is perform elaborate hoaxes on people and justify it by saying "they should know better", well sorry! , but they obviously don`t , I never humiliated the apprentices I have worked with that way, bawl em out for doing something stupid or dangerous yes, but not with the intent to humilate, even if at the end of hard day when they have done everything possible to annoy you (intentionaly or not).



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Tinkergirl
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Posted: 20th Dec 2005 18:27
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Actually, I believe Jim'll Fix It is coming back. They have a different Jim (thank goodness) but it's been talked about.

If it annoys you, don't watch it. If enough people don't watch it - it won't get made.

It's like intrusive paperatzi (sp) - they do it for money. If no-one wanted to ogle their privacy shattering snaps, then they wouldn't do it. It's the people buying the newspapers to read up on the latest airheaded celebrity gossip that fund it.
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Philip
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 00:08 Edited at: 21st Dec 2005 00:30
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@Tinkergirl

I've just spent five WHOLE hours writing an exhaustive, insightful, witty and entirely indisputable rebuttal of your post.

Then I accidentally deleted it.

.....


I think my life is over.


EDIT: Actually, I feel an urge to break out into song. Strange but true.

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Nicholas Thompson
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 00:36
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lol - I'm crap at english - were you agreeing?

I actually agree with tinkergirl. If nobody watched it, that would be it. It'd be the solution to Big Brother!

@Me!
I kinda agree. It is great to see programs which make "dreams come true", however - can you not see the funny side of that program? It was possibly a little mean, yes, but it was meant in good humour - like a good old fashioned practicle joke. People have got VERY politically correct and sensitive in these modern days compared to the era of good old white-haired-jimmy. People are perfectly happy to blame games and movies for voilence among children, yet they are perfectly happy to put an anti-drink driving commercial in the middle of X Factor (a family show) which involves a young man getting a second drink bought for him by a "friend" and then having a car accident which leaves a woman in a crumple broken pile next to the bar (you have to see it). That commercial is designed to emotionally disturb adults to the point where they wont drink drive. Whats it going to do to an 8 year old thats waiting for Shayne or Journey South to come back after the ad break?

It might seem off topic, but I think people are getting very sensitive about relatively minor things and forgetting other more important things. It is, at the end of the day, my opinion, but I think that the Space Cadets program was a funny, one off, practicle joke that ended up with the people winning £25k (a dream come true, jimmy style?). I think those people were stupid to go for that and stupid to not see through the flaws, however with hindsight, I'd happily make myself look a dumbass like that for £25k. Thats 1/6th of a house, or a quick way of clearing mine and my parters student debt and having change left over.

Peace out hehe...


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Fallout
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 01:23
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I must admit, I think people are going OTT aswell. I really dont think anybody cares! It's far more humiliating for someone to go on Jerry Springer or our chat show equivilents and get ribbed by the presenter. I guarentee when they go on to talk about their girlfriend potentially being pregnant with another mans baby, they're not forewarned that they will be made to look like a stupid pikey! At least on Space Cadets it was "hohoho, we played a joke on you and you fell for it!" not "you're basically a whore, and I'm going to tell the world on you!!!" (ala some chat shows!).

Also, on the argument that there are better way to entertain us e.g. Mr James Savalon Saville, that is true, but variety is the spice of life. The reason why we have GTA is because people wanted to try something other than Sonic. It's the same with TV really. Really nice heart warming shows are good, but there is a comic joking side to human nature which is represented by shows like Space Cadets. I still think it was really tastefully done. As far as practical jokes go, it was really elaborate and did very little harm to anyone.

I wonder how many of you guys expressing distaste for it actually watched it from start to finish (especially the finalle). If you did, and still drew the conclusion the people have been cruelly humilated then I think you need to remind yourself of how much worse the real world is.

Lemme put it this way. For 1 month off work, £25k and a real low-gravity flight, I would be happy to have been the butt of that joke.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 08:24
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Not to mention short term fame (which can be increased if you are lucky).

And no, noone cares. As to Springer, I can't believe the idiots are surprised when they announce "Yes, your wife is actually a man!", when they thought they were there to talk about washing up liquid. C'mon, it's Springer.... Chav morons who will do anything to be on tv basically

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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BatVink
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 12:29
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The maths is simple. For every bufoon tha appears on one of these shows, there are a million buffoons willing to watch it.

Obviously, my interest in Space Cadets was purely scientific and psychological, nothing to do with watching buffoons being tricked.

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Fallout
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 13:14
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It's the same with all these shows though. I watched Space Cadets to see how the hell they would convince people they were going into space. In the end, I kinda enjoyed watching that Charlie actor guy lie through his teeth and how he was saying he was wrapped up in the experience, even though he knew it wasnt real.

Same with big brother. I check out the first episode or two to see if there are any fit birds on there to perve over. If there aren't, I dont watch it. If there are, I watch it and sometimes actually start finding someone worth watching. It's painful, but it happens.

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carlito
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 14:07
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I think that "if" the cadets were stupid enough to believe that you can be 120 miles up (58 miles) in to space with no weight-less ness and to get there they didn’t feel any physical symptoms of travelling from 0mph to well over 1500+mph in under 60 seconds, then they deserve to be ridiculed on national TV, if not globally.

Lets face it, even when they were supposed to be taking off, cap-com even said “solid rocket booster detaching in 10 seconds, which would suggest that, taken the design of the shuttle being used, it would have to be attached to the undercarriage, so how the f*** did it take off like a conventional plane, the landing gear would have to be at least 45ft high!

Oh and I don’t think there is a person alive in the modern world that hasn’t seen a firework rocket take off, so why didn’t they think “the solid rocket I’m supposed to be sitting on is 1000+ x bigger and it went off like a wet sausage!!!

It doesn't say much for education today if some MDF and a few hydraulic pistons can fool kids into actually believing they are being blasted into space!
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Dazzag
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 14:39
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Quote: "It doesn't say much for education today"
Yeah, but if you selectively choose from a host of morons, then there are rich pickings. I mean there are something like 60 million people in the UK. Plenty of morons to find. Plenty...

Out of interest, how did they get them onto the "Shuttle". Considering it was supposed to be a plane (rather than vertical take off rocket effort) then how did they get them into the simulator without them seeing the outside? Or was it some hockey non-window bus (surely alarm bells ringing?) that had a connecting "hatch" or "walkway" to the "shuttle"? Can't think of a single way that wouldn't have got me thinking about things. Unless, obviously, you actually build the simulator into a plane, at massive expense. Which they didn't. I mean did they ever see the shuttle? Even a corny made up picture?

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Fallout
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 17:15
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haha. You're all very harsh. You totally underestimate the powers of suggestion. Why do you think so many highly educated muslims end up as suicide bombers? Because of a very suggestive and powerful brainwashing campaign.

It's also very harsh to expect everyone to have an understanding of rocket science and physics. It harsh to expect anyone to know anything really. Unless you've been taught it at some point, or its interested you enough to learn it yourself, you're not going to know. For example, my geography is crap because I've not really travelled much. It doesn't make me thick or moronic if someone convinced me the capital of Sweden is Sundsvall instead of Stockholm. I don't care about Sweden. How would I know?

The took these people for 4 weeks I think it was and stuck them in a school and taught them real things. They taught them 80% fact and only introduced fiction to cover their asses when there was a hole in their charade. It's only because we're computer geeks who are interested in geeky things like space rockets, science and physics, that we would've seen a flaw.

I think I'm just getting too sensitive in my old age. I dont think it's fair to label people as stupid because they don't know about the things you know about. Rocket science isn't really general knowledge either.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 17:21
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Yeah, but how did they get them to the shuttle?

Cheers

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Fallout
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Posted: 21st Dec 2005 18:09
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They showed them half of a shuttle that was kinda obscured by mist in a hanger. It was well done really. When they got on the shuttle they took them through a tunnel past technician checkpoints, then they climbed through a sci-fi kinda tunnel thing. They never saw the craft. Mmmm .. sorta semi convincing. Much like the real thing on the way there, but a strange kinda tunnel at the end to get onto it.

As with most of the things on that show, if it was a case of "Do you think this is real?" the answer would most likely be no. But as part of the whole 'suggestion' process, with them telling them it was real, it was convincing enough to avoid suspicion.

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