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Geek Culture / Gliese 581c: "Earth-like planet" - Possible existance of ET

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Venge
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 00:55
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And how would the astronauts communicate with Earth? It would take years after they landed for any signals to reach us...
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Lanfear
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 01:01
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Quote: "And how would the astronauts communicate with Earth? It would take years after they landed for any signals to reach us... "



Lol, well, if we managed & decided to send astronauts to 581c, I think science would have evolved (or improved) to having a communication system that could send 'messages' in a very (relatively) short time. This is all if, of course, lifeforms from 581c dont reach us first.
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Jrock
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 01:11
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Quote: "And how would the astronauts communicate with Earth?"

Perhaps during the voyage the crew could deploy relay stations? Then you could beam that signal back to a powerful one near the edge of the solar system and THEN beam it to Earth.

Also, doing a solar gravity assist might be possible in 40+ years, it all depends on the material used on the ship. But, now that I think about it, the crew inside would be deep-fried.

Practice makes perfect. But if nobody is perfect, why practice?
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Slayer Simon
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 01:44
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If I recall right, the theory about the earth expanding is correct. After it expands, the sun will shed its outer layers so that only the core remains. That's what we call a white dwarf. Stars don't "shrink" into white dwarfs. After a very long time, the white dwarf will (hypothetically) turn into a black dwarf AKA a black hole.
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Lanfear
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 01:55
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Does anyone have some sort of expertise on my previous questions?

A lot of media reports are throwing the term "Super-Earth" around for 581c. It's not the same planet(s) though (although quite a few planets apparently own the term).... A general term maybe, or just sensationalism...?

I have a theory on the communication issue. I once read about 'transporting' objects through space and time. Not time travel though. I cnt remember the exact term that was used, but in any case: what the experiment basically succeeded in doing was transporting a very small and simple glass cup from one end of the room to another (a short distance). Simply, the "transporting machine" broke the structure of the glass up into individual molecules and transported them through the machine. At the second machine, the glass was reassembled into a whole object again. Seems unrealistic, i know, but I've read a few articles on it. Im sure u've all seen something of the sort on star trek or any futuristic movie.
So...if we could get this machine to work over long distances (not necessarily complex objects), a message could be sent that way. I read earlier about no real time at sub-atomic level, thus I would assume the message would travel rather quickly. A bit more complex than the deploy relay station idea, but who knows. We once thought we'd never land on the moon right.
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Lanfear
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 03:02
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I'm sure the answer to this has already been posted, but after 6 hrs infront of my screen, my eyes are a little fuzzy & i didn't find it

How much longer will Gliese 581 (the sun of 581c) last than our own sun?
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dark coder
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 07:22
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Also assuming my math doesn't totally suck if you had engines capable of sustaining 4.33Gs(maximum 'safe' acceleration for civilian aircraft) it would take 40 days of that to get to 1/2 of light speed which would use a lot of fuel, require a good engine and wouldn't be that comfortable :p.

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Slayer Simon
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 07:41
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1: you would need more fuel than you could possibly carry out of the atmosphere

2: You would die, without physical conditioning, the human body would probably stop functioning after 40 days under 4 G's.

Did you know that fighter pilots regularly experience forces of 9 or 10 G's on sharp turns (but only briefly).
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Mr Makealotofsmoke
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 09:58
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even if we did some sort of electricity transport, waves only go as fast as the speed of light anyway, there has to be a way around it


Mods, its 500x100, so you cant tell me its bigger than 600x120
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Ric
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 13:39 Edited at: 4th May 2007 11:11
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Quote: "If I recall right, the theory about the earth expanding is correct"


@Simon - don't you mean the Sun? I can't think why the Earth would expand. The sun will though - it will become a red giant as it loses mass and no longer has the required gravity to prevent the expansion.


Quote: "After a very long time, the white dwarf will (hypothetically) turn into a black dwarf AKA a black hole"


A 'black' dwarf is not the same as a black hole. Our sun, or any other dwarf star, will never turn into a black hole - for that, our sun would need to be a lot more massive (maybe 20 times more massive), which would produce a neutron star, which could possibly then collapse into a black hole after going super nova. I suppose it's possible that our sun may one day get sucked into a black hole, though!

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Slayer Simon
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 22:21
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Oops! My bad, maybe I should clarify a few things. Yes, I did mean the sun, sorry about that. And our sun wouldn't turn into a black dwarf, I was thinking of a much larger star, so Ric is right. However black dwarfs and black holes are the same thing. They are hypothetical though, since we have no solid proof that they exist. It has been said that the universe isn't old enough for stars to have aged enough to become a black dwarf.

The image of a star getting sucked into a black dwarf is also hypothetical, since we haven't actually seen one yet.
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Diggsey
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Posted: 3rd May 2007 23:08
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Even if the planet is X light-years away, if we managed to reach half the speed of light, it would still only take X years, due to the crew travelling forward through time (This has been proven to happen using atomic clocks and high-speed aircraft) If we managed to travel at the speed of light, we would be in every point in the universe at once (for us) due to time being stopped for us and the time everywhere else would be going infinetely faster than our perception of time. This would mean that there would be no way of slowing down, due to nothing being able to happen in 0 seconds (including slowing down). We would simply not exist in the following 'time frame' and therefore cease to exist. (We would have successfully destroyed matter and energy) However, reaching the speed of light is impossible in the first place, because once we get near, time slows down almost to a halt, and the engines will also be working slower. The only way to get from one place to another before light does, is to find a 'shortcut'. This may be another dimension, maybe a wormhole, or maybe something completely different and never before conceived!
My physics teacher has told me that time does not exist within a black-hole, so this may also be an option.

You never know, maybe one day we will say hello to some of these:




VISIT MY WEBSITE!
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Slayer Simon
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Posted: 4th May 2007 03:47
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I disagree with everything you said there diggsey. I personally don't believe in the theory of relativity, I don't believe time would slow down when travelling faster. Whatever high-speed aircraft test you heard of is wrong and merely a subject of the "grapevine" because I have never heard of any such thing. Even If they did do that, there are so many variables involved with putting an atomic clock on a jetplane and calling it a "controlled experiment" that I would never believe anything it produced.

Even if it was true, that time would slow down, who says it has to stop at the speed of light? Where did you come to that conclusion? The speed of light isn't that fast! It takes 8 minutes to get from our sun to Earth, and 20 years to get from this new planet to us. Sure, light is fast, but in the grand scope of things, it's nothing. All around the universe at once is not what I would use to describe light!

Again, if the theory of time slowing down was true, I don't believe you could reach a complete standstill. It's like cutting something in half again and again and expecting it to disappear.

And has your physics teacher been inside a black hole? Maybe you forgot to mention that it's all hypothetical.

However, I completely agree with your assumption of wormholes and dimensions. There may be an infinite number of things to help as get there that we just havn't discovered yet.
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jasonhtml
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Posted: 4th May 2007 04:47
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Quote: "I personally don't believe in the theory of relativity"


well whether you believe it or not its been proven countless times...
and assuming that einstien was correct, time WOULD stop while going the speed of light, but since going this fast is impossible, you can't stop time, only slow it down.

Souls of Aemos Divided Tests - WIP
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Aaron Miller
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Posted: 4th May 2007 05:40
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Great find zotoaster. ^_^

Here are some shots I found on google:









Cheers,

-db


What? You mean I cant sleep here???
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Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 4th May 2007 07:41
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@Slayer Simon: It is physically impossible to travel faster than light. As we approach light speed, we approach infinite mass, requiring infinite energy (E=mc^2), which the universe doesn't have.

@DB User 2006+: Nice pics, but we've already discovered the one in 5th picture, it's called earth .


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jasonhtml
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Posted: 4th May 2007 08:07
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and the fourth pic looks like one of the planets from star wars III(literally just finished watching it )

Souls of Aemos Divided Tests - WIP
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Shadow heart
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Posted: 4th May 2007 08:43
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wow

to the ones thats trapped inside of you, this is it!!
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Ric
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Posted: 4th May 2007 12:42
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Quote: "I personally don't believe in the theory of relativity.
"


Why not? It's easier to prove than it is to disprove. Anyone can discredit the theory, but in the hundred or so years that it has been generally accepted, no-one has ever managed to disprove it experimentally, as far as I know .... but as Jason said, there are many experiments whose results agree with, and can even be predicted, by special relativity.

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