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Geek Culture / why do console games look soo good?

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David iz cool
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 15:33
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is it because the 3d engine is better? more powerful?
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Fallout
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 15:47
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Because you have low standards, young jedi.


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Osiris
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 16:04
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Not because you have low standards, its because consoles are made to play games. The units don't differ any so the developer can make it better because they know that no matter who buys it the game will always play the same. Also the PC is starting to lag behind, because its becoming cheaper to make consoles and PC are becoming too expensve to keep updated. I don't know about you but I dont want to shell out 3K a year for a new PC.

Your signature has been erased by a mod because it's larger than 600x120....
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Jess T
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 16:19
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Quote: "because its becoming cheaper to make consoles and PC are becoming too expensve to keep updated."


Um... What?
And Consoles don't get outdated?

The Wii isn't very powerful. It is cheap.
The PS3 is extremely powerful. It is very expensive.
A PC is customizable to any power you want. You pay for the power.

In 3 years time, a PC will be able to easily outperform the PS3 (Moore's Law).


David,
When you say 'look soo good', you are either being sarcastic, or are talking about something else than simply resolution and the impact of graphics.

Underneath it all, most except the newest console games still run at a resolution around 500x500.

The newer games use HDTV, which are in 1080i format, thus giving a much higher resolution, and thus increasing the crispness of the displayed image.

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Manic
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 16:34
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@Jess: I would have presumed they output either PAL, NTSC or VGA resolutions (or factors thereof), otherwise it'd cause conflicts with an awful lot of TVs. Not saying you're wrong, that's just what i thought.

Basically what Osiris said, the hardware's the same, so they can push it as hard as it will go, also, a console runs one bit of software at a time (well, that's a generalisation these days, but you get the point)

I don't have a sig, live with it.
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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 16:38
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Quote: "3K a year"

What!? My parents just spent 250 quid on a computer that is pretty much top of the range. Just don't be an idiot and get a factory built model. Overpriced and usually power-restrained by all the rubbish the manufacturer installs. No, HP, I could not care less that there are updates for the quicklaunch menu I never use because it's quicker to click on an icon. Not to mention that although you get a garuantee, you can't do much to the PC without shelling out 200 quid for an engineer. So where you get the figure of 3K from, I will never know. Or a year. This PC's nearly five years old. I have little trouble playing newer games on low settings, which is fine by me.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
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Osiris
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 16:46
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Quote: "Um... What?"


Sorry I meant consoles are becoming cheaper to make, and since they only last for about two and a half years they will start to out preform for about the first two years until the PC catches up then there will be a new one, this wont happen for a bit though. Moore's Law can only hold up for maybe thirty more years anyways before it breaks down.

Your signature has been erased by a mod because it's larger than 600x120....
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Fallout
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:02 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 17:05
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People never seem to take into account games prices when they say console are better value. You pay at least £10/game more - normally £20/game. If you're a game/month type of person, that's £200 a year - £600 over the life of your console (assuming a 3 year life span). That doesn't take into account game prices dropping in latter years, but you get my point.

You can get a PC base unit (no peripherals) that has a similar performance to a top end console (perhaps just under) for not significantly more. Considering game prices and the versatility of PCs, this image of them being crazily expensive in comparison doesn't really hold up so well.

Edit: Oh, and don't forget, everytime you buy a new PC, you add to your LAN party arsenal.


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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:10 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 17:10
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That's an excellent point, Fallout. All of these prices are preowned:



Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
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hessiess
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:14 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 17:17
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Quote: "No, HP, I could not care less that there are updates for the quicklaunch menu I never use because it's quicker to click on an icon"

i have a hp laptop and its verry good, dont care about there quick lanch thing eather! just run linux on it

game consoles dont make batter looking games, thay quickly become outdated, cost to mutch, are limited to the crappy tv resolutions, why cant thay output to a pc monotor!

learn blender, you will never regret it.

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NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:17 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 17:18
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Can't, sorry, not my laptop, and besides, is Visi-CAD on Linux?
Thought not.

You can play new PC games in a lower resolution with less detail on an older PC. Can a XBox play 360 games like this? Can a PS2 play PS3 games like this?

No.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
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hessiess
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:19 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 17:20
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sorry, i missed an i out, I just run linux on it.

technically this one isent mine ether

learn blender, you will never regret it.

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David iz cool
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:23
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Quote: "David,
When you say 'look soo good', you are either being sarcastic, or are talking about something else than simply resolution and the impact of graphics."


no im not being sarcastic,imo i think console games look better than pc games.
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Opposing force
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:51
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Quote: "Crytek: Next Gen Consoles Are Too Weak for Crysis "




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Jess T
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 17:53 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 17:55
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Manic,
500x500 was a rough estimate between the variations of PAL and NTSC. I think it's 425 scan lines they use, and each scan line can hold about 480 individual 'dots'. Something to that effect for NTSC, and almost identical for PAL, except at a different refresh rate, and with some interlacing thrown in.

When I got my PC, it cost me $1500 for a complete set up (Mobo, Ram, CPU, Graphics, Network, Keyboard, Mouse, Audio, CRT Monitor), which was at the time about half a generation behind. I got the components that were just going out of date, so they were cheaper.

If I was forking out 3K for it, I'd want it to be above and beyond the highest level PCs that are available. ie, I would never pay that much for a PC.

Don't forget also that, like Fallout said, Peripherals come into it too. If you go out and buy a new console that uses HD, you have to upgrade your TV (there's another $1000 for a decent model), whereas with PC games, even old CRT monitors can pump out a very crisp looking 1280x1024 resolution. And if you want, a new LCD, 21' will only set you back about $300 now.

Personally, I think a console like the DS is perfect

[EDIT]
Opposing force,

What's that meant to prove?
You've posted an image with absolutely no context at all.

Is it a render of a game? Real-time? Ray Traced? Does it take advantage of the PS3's multiple cell processors? Is it on PC? Is that an artist's rendition of what it will look like?
[/EDIT]

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hessiess
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 18:04
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pal: 720*575*25 frames pur sec
ntsc: 720*480*30 frames pur sec

learn blender, you will never regret it.

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Chenak
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 18:15
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Thought crysis was a dx10 game for the pc
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RalphY
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Posted: 6th Aug 2007 18:26 Edited at: 6th Aug 2007 18:29
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Quote: "Thought crysis was a dx10 game for the pc"

It is, as the quote in opposing forces post mentions, the makers of Crysis have said that consoles are not powerful enough to run Crysis, thus proving that consoles do not necessarily have better graphics than PCs.

He then backed this up further with real life photos on the left and in game screenshots from Crysis on the right, to allow for comparison of the games graphics.
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Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 00:37
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I think that at the rate PC's are improving consoles will fall far behing unless they release a new one evry year or make them like a PC and start upgrading components.

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=73324&b=8
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Aaron Miller
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 02:59
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All a console is, is a powered-down computer aimed at playing games. The operating system of the console would likely be faster than a normal operating system (Because the console's OS is likely to be a single-tasking OS, hence taking less time for execution), and there's less hardware to look after.

So, when computers become even more advanced, inheritly a console would become more advanced.

Quote: "Moore's Law can only hold up for maybe thirty more years anyways before it breaks down."

Maybe, but that can't be disproven. There's still a lot to discover about computers, energy, and resources. There's still more that can be done. And of course there's probably always going to be something that a developer can develop to make the computing experience better.


Cheers,

-naota


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tha_rami
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 03:25
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Quote: "Moore's Law can only hold up for maybe thirty more years anyways before it breaks down."


That's what they said years back too. We're never going to need more than 56k memory on a PC.... You're reasoning from current standards, that won't get you very far into the future of technology.


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RUCCUS
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 05:11
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Quote: "[EDIT]
Opposing force,

What's that meant to prove?
You've posted an image with absolutely no context at all.

Is it a render of a game? Real-time? Ray Traced? Does it take advantage of the PS3's multiple cell processors? Is it on PC? Is that an artist's rendition of what it will look like?
[/EDIT]"


Its Crysis, an FPS in the works using the "Crytek engine". Look er' up on youtube, those graphics are real-time during gameplay. Some pretty amazing stuff they've got going on.


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Jess T
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 05:16
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Ok, I did look it up briefly after I read that post, but my point still stands. All that was posted was an image. It has no context and could be absolutely anything.

It's like if someone were arguing about apples and oranges, then a third person came in, put down what looked like a week-old apple and just walked away. Where's the context? How does it help in the argument? What point are you trying to get across.

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andrey d
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 05:22
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Because you sit farther from the tv. Try looking at your monitor from 20 ft away while playing some game, and the quality will automatically be "better". While there are other reasons, I think this is one of the major ones. PC games have higher quality when set to high quality settings anyways.
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Osiris
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 06:32
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Quote: "We're never going to need more than 56k memory on a PC...."


Im not sure you know what Moore's Law is, but well I meant it will all be pointless once we co to the age of quantum computing, its should not take all that long now, we can compute on one atom, just not many, but once we figure it out it'll be good.

Your signature has been erased by a mod because it's larger than 600x120....
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indi
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 07:22
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640k, dear me 56k indeed.

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Opposing force
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 10:26
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Calm down Jess...

http://www.freewebs.com/teammegabasic/
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Kieran
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Posted: 7th Aug 2007 12:29
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Hmm well a super computer can own yourz PS3z no matter whatz you n00bz say! L33t c0mpuT4g3

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