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M22RDY

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Joined: 8th Oct 2011

Location: SC, UK

Posted: 9th Oct 2011 21:25

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Hello All,

I have just ordered the Bonanza pack for DBPro etc with all the trmmings. I have in mind an idea on a couple of games I'm wanting to create. Initially I want a top down 3D driving game similar to GTA1 (only car). Secondly is a 'large' 3D RPG similar to Shining in the Darkness

Not looking to rip off these games, however, I'm not sure how to start. I have read that its really easy to create games but i've been messing with the Pro demo for around 2 days and i've got nothing that would even resemble a wall in a maze.

Where would the best place to start be to begin learning the basics and working my way up. I had tried the tutorials (although some didnt work properly) and i'm still confused?

Murdy

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Somarl

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Posted: 9th Oct 2011 23:05 Edited at: 9th Oct 2011 23:08

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Most people start at the TDK tutorials but there is some other useful stuff i found here and there. I would also recommend buying the Hands on DB pro Volume 1 (and 2 if your going into 3d) if you have a few spare pounds. They are really good books and definatley good for people like myself who have never programmed before.

After all this you could probably get help on individual commands you might be stuck on by either searching the forums for that command or posting your own thread up if you have a more specific problem. Thats what i do. Hope some of this helps

http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=codebase_list&l=2 - Lots of examples in here like mini demos people have done, you can learn a lot by just looking at some of these that take your fancy and playing around with them after looking at any commands you dont understand by just searching google.

http://www.youtube.com/dcforemanuk - DC Foremans youtube channel, lots of vids, some not relevant to DBpro but there is a hell of a lot on there that are, just got to go through the,

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=110324&b=7 - Tutorial on types, very useful

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/DarkBASIC_Programming

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=99497&b=10 TDK Tutorials - This is the big one that most new folks get pointed to.

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=63411&b=7 - This is a bit more for 3d stuff but useful anyway.

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=25076&b=7 Downloadable Beginner Book

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=68702&b=7 General Tutorials - Lots of stuff here.

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zenassem

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Location: Long Island, NY

Posted: 11th Oct 2011 00:31 Edited at: 11th Oct 2011 00:34

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IIRC the original GTA was a 2D top-down game, done with a tilemap. Sometimes the view would zoom in/out depending on the action. If you are looking to do something like this, you'll need to look at multi-layer tile maps, multidimensional arrays, smooth-scrolling, sprite collisions with sprites and with tile-world, very basic physics for car acelleration and handling.

The second game, might be easier to actually do in 3d. If you want to recreate it the way it was done, it's really not much different from the first game. Still have a multi-dimensional array to store info about the world/maze, but rather than a tile-map, you would implement a simple raycasting engine to give the pseudo-3d appearance to the world.

I don't mean to make either of these sound as though they are easy to implement. Each game has a lot of information that needs to be stored/retrieved/calculated & displayed. As well as a well coded FSM (Finite State Machine) to drive the logic. To pull either of them off you'll have to be well versed in most of dbpro except perhaps much of the 3d/multiplayer sections. It's not just knowing the commands per se, but knowing how to combine them to get what you need from dbpro. I could probably fill a book just with the subtle quirks/techniques required to work with 2d media in dbpro. So It would be good to get a good foundation of the principles, and then attack the specifics like what a tile-engine is, what a raycast engine is, how to produce a virtual 3d environment from raycast on a 2d image or multi-dimensional array etc...

Your signature has been erased by a mod please reduce it to 600 x 120.

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M22RDY

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Posted: 14th Oct 2011 00:10

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Many thanks for the guides, i'm currently working on developing my experience using them.

Further more to the above mentioned projects, I think firstly i'm going to tackle the maze rpg equivalent. Now, there are some key elements that i've considered and actually want to stick with.

2D maze rather than 3D. Now this would make little sense however, with the original style game being available on the mega drive (genesis) the scope for actual 3d on this console was slim, so its an interpreted 3d maze on a 2d game.

I'm still sussing out what approach to take for this, including other basic elements such as multi-character experience, levelling etc. still keeping in tow with 2d last-last-last-gen

I found this gameplay video on youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S57gSJ8z7fs

So, going forward, if anyone can give me a starting point to research where to begin this would be great

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zenassem

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Posted: 14th Oct 2011 00:58 Edited at: 14th Oct 2011 02:09

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Accidental double post!

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zenassem

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Posted: 14th Oct 2011 02:08

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I will have to study the trailer you posted of the game a bit. Because from memory of it, I don't think it was as 'pseudo-3D' as the included example below. Some of the older games were a unit by unit movement... turns were all set to 90 degrees, which results in simplifying the programming further, but it also limits the end-users view and input-control. I'll post back after my review of the clip. in the meantime...

Ill try to help you search for better examples. The first thing I would look into a pseudo-3D raycasting engine. I am not aware of your background, but I sometimes look outside of DB specific tutorials to find examples. Generally, even if I may not be apt at the chosen programming language, I can gain enough info as long as I have a basic familiarity with programming concepts. Diagrams and pictures also help.

The following tutorial discusses a pseudo 3d engine via raycasting and a 2d map.

http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/creating-pseudo-3d-games-with-html-5-can-1/

EDIT
As I suspected the game you are referencing seems to limit the player to a grid. Movement is unit by unit on the 2d map. Turns are automatically 90 degrees, though there is 'panning' during the turn. Unlike some older games where the 90 degree turn is instant, which results in the player being confused about their orientation, even if there is an overhead map.

Since the player is confined to a grid, collision checking is much simpler.

Here is an example of a dungeon crawler with instant 90 degree turns and limited unit by unit movement.
http://blog.rag.no/post/Building-a-pseudo-3d-game-using-SilverTile.aspx

Your game would be sort of a hybrid between the 2.

What specific aspect do you need help with?

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M22RDY

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Posted: 15th Oct 2011 10:09

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hi zenassem,

Were starting to get there now. There are two approaches that i'm considered (actually only two that I think I know of).

- Embedding the map into an array which I have read a little on but still am rather unfamiliar with including an overhead map option.

- Draw each wall individually using 'make objects' then controlling movement and camera to continue along a forward back - 90degree motion including actually animating the movement.

The 2nd senario i'm up against is the random battle encouter associted including certain enemies appearing within only certain parts of the maze

3rd senario is a levelling system based upon exp abd stat points including outbranching with new weapons.

4th senario battle system based upon current exp and stat points against enemy stats including critical hit and miss commands boost and powerups including drops & money.

5th senario party, including gathering party members and allowing turnbased action

I think i've got the stat system, battle system and even levelling system sussed (with work) but its just getting it all together

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M22RDY

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Posted: 19th Oct 2011 20:15

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OK,

Moving forward from my previous posts Im now running DBPro and still learning as I go along.

Initially I have discovered how to roll with a matrix grid for the floor, just working on the walls which I think im going to design using an array to plot (still no idea but that's the next task)

I've come up with the following

Including a demonstrator video showing the 90 degree block turn movement, so this is a good start, just need to add walls...

YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4P-TeRYZ1F4

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M22RDY

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Posted: 22nd Oct 2011 20:03

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Further now, I'm experiencing some difficulty that I need some advice.

As the game is 1st person view and basically linear movement - forward, back, left 90 right 90 degree I tried using the camera as movement control, this worked to the stage of object collision (where i just kept walking through walls)

Not I have used an object for the collision, which now has been hidden but works a treat for camera & collision.

Now the snag - I tried re-doing the code to turn 90 degree in the loop that worked with the camera but there is no fluent movement anymore. Can someone please explain where I went wrong?

+ Code Snippet

	If Leftkey()=1
	
	leftrotate = 1
	
	
	repeat
	
	leftrotate = leftrotate + 3 `'3' rotation speed
	if leftrotate >90 then leftrotate = 90 `keeping perfect 90 degree angle
	Yrotate object 2,Wrapvalue(aY#-leftrotate)
	
	`Detect collision unneeded
	`If Object collision(2,0)>0 then position object 2,X#,0,Z#
	
	X# = Object position x(2)
	Z# = Object position z(2)
	
	`New camera position and store in cZ# and cX#
	cZ# = Newzvalue(Z#,aY#-180,100)
	cX# = Newxvalue(X#,aY#-180,100)
	
	`Position camera
	Position Camera cX#,200,cZ#
	
	`Point the camera object
	Point camera X#,200,Z#
	
	Sync
	
	wait 2
	
	until leftrotate = 90
	
	endif

I know the codes 'rough' but i'm still working on getting it to work

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