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Geek Culture / Microsoft acknowledged Windows 8 as a mistake

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 21st May 2013 18:43
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Quote: "Bit like Donald Trump trying to dress up street style for a Jay Z after party."


Yep.

Quote: "Still underneath, it is the latest WPF enhanced .NET framework 4.5 operating system, so technically W8 is the most versatile and advanced domestic OS in the world. Goes to show how the marketing and strategic department can mess things up."


Sadly true from what I've heard: for example, that W8 is much faster to boot up, etc. If true it's a shame they've messed around with the rest.
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Mobiius
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Posted: 21st May 2013 19:32
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Windows 8 would be good if they targeted it towards the specific markets.

Metro UI default for touch devices, classic mode for none touch devices. That said, I don't have a real problem with the interface at all. I find pressing the windows key and typing to work the same way as in windows 7/vista so that doesn't bother me.

What I hated was the incompatibility of previously working programs in windows 8. Half the programs I used fine in 7 failed to work in 8, and THAT was a major failure by Microsoft.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 21st May 2013 21:24
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I don't think Microsoft had a choice to join the "Apple after party," they have to get real estate in mobile computing before PC really starts to dry up on them.
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 22nd May 2013 00:12 Edited at: 22nd May 2013 00:16
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I think the best move for MS on this would have been to make Metro optional and perhaps add a couple of other features.

I love using metro, but not everybody does and in that regard I think it's a shame. Regardless, you can still get rid of it, so anybody who gets a computer with Win 8 on it doesn't have to be forced into using metro.

I don't think it's THAT much of a failure, needs some changes/improvements. I just think it fails to win over many metro sceptics and people who dislike metro and I think it could have been marketed better.

For touch devices as well, the metro interface is fantastic, I've preferred it over all other touch-friendly interfaces, whilst I do not use the touch features on my Win 8 PC, I love it on my Windows Phone 7.8, it was actually one of the deciding factors in purchasing the phone. Having said this, I have been thinking of buying a monitor (I use a HDTV at the moment) and I've seen touch screen IPS monitors like this one: I might find it tempting to get one, not just to utilise a touch interface but also as a graphics tablet, might be useful for texturing 3D models (for example) and drawing various concepts - I suck artistically with a mouse, so it works an alternative to something like a Wacom, as I was previously thinking of buying one.

With thinks like touch monitors I can see why MS decided to use the metro interface with their desktop OS. And whilst I am a lover, I will admit there are things MS should have done better, but of course those things don't really affect me as such.

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Airslide
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Posted: 22nd May 2013 08:51
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My only really issue (besides not being a huge fan of the visual style - just a little too flat) is that the operating system feels like two in one. If the desktop and 'Modern UI' felt a little more integrated with one another, in terms of visuals and functions, I would like it a lot better.

In fact I think it'd be pretty cool if Microsoft let you throw metro apps into a desktop window - they really had the opportunity to mix and match the classic desktop with the one-app-at-a-time approach common on tablets and could have created something with a lot of flexibility for a lot of form factors. Instead, the desktop has been regulated as a "legacy" component and the Modern UI is too restricted to be useful for a lot of serious work. I feel like there is a lot of potential being wasted.
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Nickydude
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Posted: 30th May 2013 17:23
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Microsoft 'U-turn' sees Start button back on Windows 8

Quote: "Microsoft has confirmed a Start button is returning to the desktop mode's taskbar of its Windows 8 operating system.

The lack of the facility - which had been in every previous version since Windows 95 - has been one of the most controversial aspects of the software.

However, it will not offer all the functionality previously associated with the feature."


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22714048

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Slow Programmer
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Posted: 30th May 2013 20:48
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Quote: "However, it will not offer all the functionality previously associated with the feature.""


So basically Microsoft are extending a middle finger to their customers and telling them they still don't know what they need. If it does not do what the Start button as done in the past it is not a Start button. I predict even more confusion. Some people (companies) never seem to learn from their mistakes though.

There are two kinds of computer users. Those that use Macs and those that wish they did.
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 30th May 2013 23:00 Edited at: 30th May 2013 23:02
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BRING THE USER BACK TO THE METRO INTERFACE??

WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY THINKING???

REALLY Microsoft? REALLY??

They REALLY think people wanted a GUI button to take them to the Metro Interface when they specifically said they wanted a start button?!?!?!

Ugh. Microsoft's decision making capabilities are clearly terrible right now.
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bitJericho
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Posted: 31st May 2013 03:37
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Quote: " They REALLY think people wanted a GUI button to take them to the Metro Interface when they specifically said they wanted a start button?!?!?!"


The vast majority of people I know that have problems finding the start button don't know about the bottom left hand corner.

The metro interface as a "start menu" is superior to the previous start menus anyway.

When XP launched people hated the new start menu, now people use it because it's the standard and everyone's better off for it. Metro is the same way!

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 31st May 2013 03:56
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I mean, I guess if it's a really enhanced start menu, it's fine...

Maybe I can just pretend it's a full screen start menu made for a tablet!! Hooray Microsoft, hooray.
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bitJericho
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Posted: 31st May 2013 04:13
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In what context is the start menu more useful "windowed"?

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 31st May 2013 04:54
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Haha! I don't see full screen as an issue, instead the being designed for a tablet is more of an issue. But meh, I guess it can't be that bad. If I were in charge of what MS was doing, I would provide some customization option to allow the start button to take you to either the start screen or to the conventional start menu seen in before versions of Windows.
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 31st May 2013 20:21
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I personally use Metro the same way I use the Start Menu. Tap Windows Key, type half of what I want to open, press enter when it finds it.

Metro just shows up on the screen more, but it's all the same to me tbh.
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 31st May 2013 20:42
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Quote: "Maybe I can just pretend it's a full screen start menu made for a tablet!! Hooray Microsoft, hooray. "


What do you mean pretend? That's exactly what it is.

The tiles are essentially your favourites, but designed in such away it pretty much works like Stardock Fences, 'All Apps' is essentially 'All Programs' (my only criticism of it is that you can't collapse folders), you can type into it and search like you can in the old start menu, if you want control panel, network settings and other settings you go to the top right. You can also restart/shutdown/sleep and even log out with it too. It's really only missing Folders/My Computer, which can easily be accessed via desktop mode, either from the desktop itself or via the task bar.

I wouldn't really say the Metro start menu lacks functionality, it just puts that functionality you're used to in different places as part of its redesign.

Like CoffeeGrunt, I use Metro as my start menu. I have had the option to get third party software, but have felt no need to. Not everybody's cup of tea, I'll admit, but I have no quarrels with it.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 31st May 2013 23:31
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Ah, I see. I guess my initial reaction was due to me thinking the metro interface it brought up was an alternative to the desktop and not a start menu of sorts, so I got pretty upset!
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bond1
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Posted: 1st Jun 2013 03:22
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Every time I think about moving to Windows 8, I come to the same conclusion: why bother? It doesn't bring anything useful to me over Windows 7.

I am not a Luddite. I love new tech. But I absolutely don't get the infatuation with touchscreens at all. Why would I want to put fingerprints on a shiny, glare-prone surface,something I'm going to be looking at?

I bought an Android tablet, the novelty wore off after about 2 weeks and it's collecting dust now. I'll grab my laptop EVERY single time.

SPECS: Intel Corei7 3770k, Nvidia GTX680, 16GB RAM, Win7 Pro
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 1st Jun 2013 03:47
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I am exactly the same way. While Windows 8 does have a really really nice kernel, I just don't think the advantages would be worth the effort and dealing with the GUI.
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Benjamin
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Posted: 1st Jun 2013 04:01
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I have Vista and feel the same way. It it ain't broke, don't fix it. Though inevitably MS will drop support for it so I'll have to 'upgrade' to a newer OS.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 1st Jun 2013 04:16
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Windows 7 will be the way to go there! Although support for that is dropping after not long...

I thought MS already dropped support for Vista?
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 1st Jun 2013 10:33
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Quote: "Ah, I see. I guess my initial reaction was due to me thinking the metro interface it brought up was an alternative to the desktop and not a start menu of sorts, so I got pretty upset!"


The way it's designed makes it useful as an alternative desktop for touch devices, but in reality, it's just a glorified start menu.

Quote: "Every time I think about moving to Windows 8, I come to the same conclusion: why bother? It doesn't bring anything useful to me over Windows 7."


I think that is fair. I paid £25 to upgrade when it was originally released, so it was at a price I could upgrade with and to be honest, I may invest in a touch monitor, I've been meaning to get a graphics tablet, but I think I would prefer a touch monitor plus a pen (to avoid unnecessary marks).

If the touch isn't something you're interested in, it might not be a worthy upgrade - there are some other useful things other than metro, but perhaps not enough to justify the upgrade. However, if you were to buy a new PC with it on, I don't see many people feeling the need to downgrade the OS to purge their new system of Windows 8, even if you don't get along with metro because there are solutions for it.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 2nd Jun 2013 06:35
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As is always the case with Windows, unlike OS X, you can gut out and replace more or less all of the things you don't like, and add in some things you do.
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Airslide
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Posted: 4th Jun 2013 09:37
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Quote: "As is always the case with Windows, unlike OS X, you can gut out and replace more or less all of the things you don't like, and add in some things you do."


*Sigh* I don't understand where this pervasive belief that OS X cannot be customized but Windows can comes from. Is it iOS?

I have found OS X and Windows equally resilient to extensive UI tampering without third party software. But there are apps for OS X that, for instance, reskin all of the stock apps (particularly since they got more iOS-ified with a more skeuomorphic design). I don't use them but there's lots of apps that tweak visuals and behavior just like there are for Windows, and all kinds of configuration tricks using the Terminal or Apple Script.

If you want an OS you can truly gut and replace parts on, get Linux or BSD.
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