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Geek Culture / FAR Better than PSP, and you can make your own commercial 3d games for it!

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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 17:58 Edited at: 25th Sep 2005 15:05
Forget the PSP or DS - you NEED one of these:





http://www.gbax.com/

I have the predecessor, the GP32blu, and its amazing - I play Quake, Doom, Sam & Max, DivX (full DVDs ripped!), Mp3s, Megadrive, Snes, Mame with no problems. This is even better - and it only costs 125 pounds, or 45quid extra for an extra 1gb memory!

"To sum up the GP2X:

It can play games. It can play your Movies. It can play your music. It can view photos. It can read Ebooks. It runs on just 2 AA batteries - And it can do all this in the palm of your hand or on your TV screen.

Yes that's right, this handheld can connect to the TV, console style. Watch your DivX movies on the TV. Play emulated classics on the TV. Try big screen Quake. Or just play them all on the GP2X's large 320*240 backlit screen. You get the best of both worlds.

It runs the free Linux operating system. This means a whole world of Games, Utilities and Emulators are at your disposal. Quake, Doom, SNES, Megadrive, MAME, Media players and Applications to name just a few.

It's powerful - Two 200mhz CPU's with 64meg of RAM, custom graphics hardware and decoding chips. Takes SD cards and has 64M of NAND memory. [edit] you can use cheap memory cards 1gb+ for storage! [/edit][/b] Plenty to play with. One of the most powerful and advanced handhelds today.

That means it can play movies without any re-encoding. Just put them onto an SD card. Any size. Any resolution. No messing about. The GP2X scaling chip will resize to fit the screen. No other handheld can do that. [edit] most portable media players cost 400quid+ and this doesn it better! [/edit]

It's cheap. Just £124.99.

It's open. You want to develop your own games for the GP2X? Go right ahead. The SDK is included with the system free. Not since the days of the Amiga has a system been so easy to develop for, commercially and for fun.

The GP2X isn't just another wannabe be Gameboy. Its a whole different design. A whole new idea for a handheld games system.

But wait, we're not new to the scene. Heard of the GP32? An accidental experiment in an open source handheld that went right. Some 30,000 units were sold worldwide, mostly in the UK and parts of Europe. The machine has an astonishing following. The GP2X is the successor."


I seriously don't understand how anyone will not want one of these. Unfortunately they're bound to not have the money to advertise, so they'll never beat the PSP. But at least it won't fail, the gp32 is still going very strong. but the tech specs on this new model are astounding - the games it would be possible to make are astounding. You could use the free id engines for quake 1 or 2 and make blumming briallant games for it yourself. Come on - ya know you want too

Jiffy
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 18:28
Sounds great, looks great. I don't think I'll be able to get one yet, but it looks great none-the-less. And since it runs on Linux... Woohoo!


Got to love Resident Evil 0! Currently playing for the: 5th time
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 18:34 Edited at: 24th Sep 2005 18:41
I was thinking of getting the previous one. However, the SDK was only for GCC (and I'm not going to get that) - only emulated code could be compiled in VS.

Ah - its still Linux... I've enquired about the SDK, but if its as much as a pain as the last one, then I wont bother...

Come to the third DarkBasic Pro Sci Fi Con - Be there and be square
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lagmaster
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 22:18
i've picked up the gp32 in a sale the other day. might give this new version a few months before i purchase it.

looks promising

lagmaster - irc.devhat.net <--
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Raven
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 22:28
They had the website on another forum recently saying it's a cheap way to make PSP stuff.

I barely like the PSP; wouldn't even have one if I didn't need it for work. Seriously doubt they're doing themselves any favours using Linux without making some sort of full SDK similar to what Sony do.

Not that Sony's is exactly fantastic. I swear that's the most pig-headed system to develop for.

Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 22:31
get a psp like i am

Gtas back and bigger and better than before
Megaton Cat
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 22:41 Edited at: 24th Sep 2005 22:45
The fact that this is actually $100 cheaper, yet more powerfull then the PSP is a good enough reason to buy on it's own.

Definatly interested in one of these. Can it run something like SNES/N64 emulators?


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
ionstream
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 23:03
Holy moley that thing looks awesome.

But one thing concerns me, does it have an WiFi support?

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Jeku
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Posted: 24th Sep 2005 23:45
The GP32 is cool-- another programmer from work got one imported from Asia. He can run NES ans SNES games on it, and it hooks up to his comp via USB cable.

Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 00:00
"I was thinking of getting the previous one. However, the SDK was only for GCC (and I'm not going to get that) - only emulated code could be compiled in VS. Ah - its still Linux... I've enquired about the SDK, but if its as much as a pain as the last one, then I wont bother..."
The SDK is full and complete with the new one. Its quite easy and far more powerful this time around

"Seriously doubt they're doing themselves any favours using Linux without making some sort of full SDK similar to what Sony do."
- You get a full and decent SDK when you buy the unit, its VERY easy to make very powerful 2d apps - you can also Use IDs GPL Quake engine for making 3d games which as you know is easy and powerful. Theres also some more complicated options but I've seen some fantastic demos made with it.

DBMAd "get a psp like i am" - ummm they cost nearly twice the price are are less powerful by Specs, plus this uses infinitley better memory system, NO loading times, LOOOONG battery life, far better and more compatible media player, infinite free games, movies, mp3s etc - I could go on...

"Can it run something like SNES/N64 emulators?"
The one I have (thegp32, model below this) can run SNES, Megadrive, Neogeo, MAME, Atari ST, NES, SMS very well. And I'm 100% sure that the new more powerful machine will be able to run 32x, Saturn, PSX & N64 stuff within months of developers getting their hands on dev kits Also higher spec PC games should be ported soon too, definitely Q2 based, maybe Q3 now too as its been released as source - that'd really allow for some cool homebrew stuff!

"does it have an WiFi support?" I don't think so. But it has plenty of expansion ports, so probably easy to link to pc/laptop compatible wifi devices - don't forget this runs linux so drivers for almost anything will be written.

Anyway I'm not trying to preach to sell ones, I'm not making money from it or anything... I just think this is really cool - the spec is awesome and if you look at their site they are actively asking for indie game developers like us to send indeas for games and they might even hire you to make the commercial games...

xtom
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 00:33
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 00:53
Quote: "he SDK is full and complete with the new one. Its quite easy and far more powerful this time around"

Is it GCC only or can VS users compile and run programs on it?

Come to the third DarkBasic Pro Sci Fi Con - Be there and be square
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 01:11
I think VS users should be able to use it, but I can't confimr that until the final version is out with the console. It looks like It may well come with its own compiler and programming suite too anyways

Raven
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 02:59
Quote: "- You get a full and decent SDK when you buy the unit, its VERY easy to make very powerful 2d apps - you can also Use IDs GPL Quake engine for making 3d games which as you know is easy and powerful. Theres also some more complicated options but I've seen some fantastic demos made with it."


That really is a good example of my point.
For something like this to take off, or really for Linux as a whole to stop being for nerds huddled in a basement believing that C/ASM is the be-all and end-all of computer experience. They will need to make a Platform SDK just like Gizmondo (which btw is also Free to develop for and a but more well known) which provides you with everything you need in order to develop for it out of the box without having to use other peoples engines, etc.

I also doubt that it is provides you with a simple threading solution like the Playstation 3 and X-Box 360 SDKs do.
God the X-Box 360 is the most beautiful system to develop for... it's just so damn nice!

Quote: "Is it GCC only or can VS users compile and run programs on it?"


Judging from the SDK I downloaded (which might be cut down) looks like it's GCC only. It does use ELF though so, I doubt you'd even really need thier SDK to develop for it. Just code like you would a normal Linux application.

Most people I know who dev for linux hate coding on it. they prefer to dev on windows or macosx then test under linux.

yet more powerfull then the PSP is a good enough reason to buy on it's own.

It has Dual 200MHz x86-32 Processors. Compare that to the Dual 233MHz 32-bit MIPS (R4000) in the Playstation Portable.. there is very little contest performance wise.

The PSP also has a dedicated Graphics Processor with 2 Pipelines (just like the Playstation 2). This has .. I have no idea. It doesn't say at all. It's nice, but I'm not overly impressed by it.

The Nintendo DS is £99.99, that's with Mario64 or something. Powerwise again I'm pretty sure because of it's more dedicated design nature, it could run circles around it.

What this needs to provide a more useful platform is
a) An SDK that provides a generic interface to allow easy development to begin with.
b) A 3D GPU, like an Imageon or GoForce3D. Both are highly powerful GPU for low-energy requirement systems.
c) Use a RISC CPU Design, the PowerPC 750FX for example is very low-power needs but can pump out over 2x the power of the GameCube.
d) A more ergonomic design.. sorry but it doesn't look very comfortable. Or light.

It looks like an interesting project to be sure, but don't see it being something to be overly hyped about. Perhaps if ther was something there like DBP to bridge the developer gap.

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 03:16 Edited at: 25th Sep 2005 03:17
Quote: "sorry but it doesn't look very comfortable."


You leap at people the second they say the new Revolution controller doesn't look comfortable, yet you claim this new machine isn't comfortable having never held it? You make quite the hypocrite I must say.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
Ian T
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 03:18
Ok I'm sold.

$180 please? Anyone?

Blog is death. How? NO idea. But is murder. REVENGE!
The admiral
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 03:39
Raven is right the psp is still more powerful and user friendly but still its a nice attempt.

The admiral
Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 04:19 Edited at: 25th Sep 2005 04:25
I agree that not much has been said about the graphics chip, doesn't say if it has a dedicated 3D GPU however I would be surprised if it didn't because the native demos a friend of mine showed me on a prototype were very impressive, a fps, a wipeout style game and a arcade style racer, all of which had some nice lighting and alpha'd particles. Those were tech demos of future games in development. The home brew stuff I have seen has been more along the lines of ps1 style graphics though, but with the Q1 & (soon) 2 engines to mod and make games in, this can still make some impressive looking 3d games quickly.

The main plus point for me is the fact that you can link it to a pc via usb and trandfer your dvds, divx, mpg, mp3, ogg, wma etc without having to conveert / optimse them etc, it'll play anything, and load right away without the need for the UMD with their moving parts, high battery drain and loading times.

I can't speak for the new unit as its not out fully yet but my older one has amazing battery life too, and uses 2 standard AA which I personally prefer to having to recharge a unit all the time, what happens if they run out on a journey?

[edit] Oooh I just noticed it also outputs to TV so you could play your games / videofiles on a big screen if you wanted also. I WISH the psp did that, as I'd love to play Wipeout Pure, Ridge Racers and Librety City Stories on a TV (yes I admit I DO want all those PSP games but I'd prefer them on Ps2/on a tv for reasons previously discussed in other threads )

PowerSoft
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 09:42
Do you "charge the PSP or is it batteries?

Dot Merix
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 10:28
It has a lithium-ion(believe that's how you spell it) battery in it which can be charged.



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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 10:46
I certainly wont be getting the first
Probably wait until the SDK has been finalised and then think about it...

Come to the third DarkBasic Pro Sci Fi Con - Be there and be square
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Darkbasic MADPSP
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 10:51
Quote: "It has a lithium-ion(believe that's how you spell it) battery in it which can be charged."


That's good to hear

Quote: "I certainly wont be getting the first
Probably wait until the SDK has been finalised and then think about it..."


Like i asid psp is better it in a case and off you go plus it is a lot smaller

Gtas back and bigger and better than before
Arkheii
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 12:27
I'd buy it if it had a touch screen. It's more powerful than my PocketPC, but I don't find it as indispensible as something that also helps me get my schoolwork done. ^_^

Sounds good to have though.

Sun = Hell in the sky.
Jeku
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 14:34
Why does it matter if it's more powerful than a PSP? Do you honestly think that any of us will create something that will push a PSP to its limits? Let's get real here, folks. It's not about cutting edge, it's about fun games. Where in history did we forget this?

Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 15:04 Edited at: 25th Sep 2005 15:07
DBMad, I'm not flaming you and everyone's entitled to an opinion. In fact I don't like how some ppl have been mean to you at least you're trying to learn stuff and help others. but I have to comment on this (foprgive me I feel compelled)

"It has a lithium-ion(believe that's how you spell it) battery in it which can be charged." - "That's good to hear"

WHY?? That is probably the worst thing about the psp. the battery life is VERY low, friends of mine have them and frequently the batteries run out in the middle of a commute to London or LA to work. They then can't play the psp again until they get off the train/plane and to a power point. Using AA batteries means that if they run out, hey you've got some spare in your wallet, or can buy some from the onboard shop. Heck, you can buy 24AAs in the pound shop for a quid! And if its the rechargableness you like, get rechargable AAs! The battery life on my GP32 is 8-10 hours of playing games or movies. The PSP is lucky to get 2.5 in my experience.

"I certainly wont be getting the first
Probably wait until the SDK has been finalised and then think about it..." - "Like i asid psp is better it in a case and off you go"

Umm these comments are unrelated. SDK means "software development kit", so you can make your own games and software. You can also play premade games and moveis just like the PSP

The PSP does not come with a free SDK that allows normal PC users to make and sell games for it! (If it does and I've somehow missed this I apologise unreservedly and will run to the shops and buy a PSP) This doesn't, and thats the point. Thats why I posted it on these forums. As far as I know, the only way that normal people can make PSP software or games is by hacks that go on memory sticks not UMDs and these, whilst fun, are illegal and you could never sell them as commercial games / apps, nor take advantage of the 3d power of the psp to it fullest.

"plus it is a lot smaller" - Um what are you basing that on? They are practically the same size, the GP2X is slightly thicker due to the need for AA batteries, but I just explained why I personally think thats much better. Maybe the first pic I posted was unclear, heres a pic from the side (you can get them in white or black):


Anyways I'm not trying to flame you or start an arguemnt, its just frustrating that maybe you misunderstood my post Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, and as I posted I do like the psp, especially some of the games on it, I just think its overpriced, and these re slightly better. Its down to personal taste tho

@ Jeku "Let's get real here, folks. It's not about cutting edge, it's about fun games. Where in history did we forget this?"
Couldn't agree more in my 20 favourite games to this day, only 1 is from this current generation of consoles, a few from the dc, about 10 from the 32-64 bits, and the rest either classic arcade / early pc / or 8-16 bit machines

Kohaku
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 15:29
It seems quite cool.


You are not alone.
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 15:35
Quote: "so you can make your own games and software. You can also play premade games and moveis just like the PSP"

Yes, but I have no need to get any portable games (take no long journey and any games are played on my laptop or desktop machine) - hence the reason why I'm not bothering with a PSP (unless they release a free SDK) - I'm only really interested in the development side.

Come to the third DarkBasic Pro Sci Fi Con - Be there and be square
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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 15:54
Sorry Nick it wasn't meant to sound like I was aiming that comment at you, I wasn't - I was answering DBMads reply to your comment and noting that his reply had nothing to do with your comment in the first place I fully understood what you meant and pretty mucha gree with what you just said also, although personally I also love using such things for emulation, and media playing whilst around & about

Jiffy
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 16:01
@Kangaroo2 BETA2 (from a few posts back) - I heard on IGN that a company is making a thing called PSP2TV that will get - you guessed it - a PSP to play on a TV! Aparently it will squish the widescreen down on regular TVs though, which is a shame.


Got to love Resident Evil 0! Currently playing for the: 5th time
Megaton Cat
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 16:03
This thng looks perfect sized. Dunno what you people are raving about.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
Arkheii
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 16:17
Quote: "Why does it matter if it's more powerful than a PSP? Do you honestly think that any of us will create something that will push a PSP to its limits? Let's get real here, folks. It's not about cutting edge, it's about fun games. Where in history did we forget this?"


"EA Games -- License Everything" *blink!*

Sun = Hell in the sky.
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 23:09
Quote: " Sorry Nick it wasn't meant to sound like I was aiming that comment at you"

Thats okay

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BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 23:14 Edited at: 25th Sep 2005 23:17
Hmmm, I'll want to nab either this or the gizmondo. I'm liking Gizmondo right now though, because frankly I don't want to work around in the Quake engine for 3d stuff.

The only SDK info I found on gizmondo though was a little page where you could request information on becoming a developer, what up with that?


I'm going to eat you!
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 23:28
Dont think the Gizmondo will last long... Oh, and there are no free SDK's for it (I've asked) - you have to be a developer.

Come to the third DarkBasic Pro Sci Fi Con - Be there and be square
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ionstream
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Posted: 25th Sep 2005 23:38
I think the AA battery will work out well, the chargers for NimH batteries are so small nowadays. And if you dont use those, you can get a 24 pack of Duracell Alkalines at Home Depot for like $12.

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Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 01:26
Agreetotally on the batteries And yeah its a shame about the gizmondo developing thing, I emailled them too a while back, they aren't too friendly towards indie developers And by the sound of it they don't have many major ones interested lol

BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 04:27
Ah weel, guess it's back to the Ti 83.


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Oneka
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 04:34
Iam sorry but that thing needs to step upto todays standards! it need rechargable batterys......no one uses AA anymore xD

Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
TDP Enterprises
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 04:46
Quote: " Ti 83."
I have the Ti-84 premium be-atch, what now?!?!?!?

Actually i just got it and have no effen clue how to use it, i had to ask the class nerd-bomber how in the hell to put games on it.

“A lot of people approach risk as if it’s the enemy when it’s really fortune’s accomplice” - Sting“
.......S-S-D-D.......
BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 05:47
What a hacker, you and your leet Ti 84 premium. If you can find it, you should get Hick Quest. That is the coolest game for calculator, works on practically any of them because it only uses basic math and text commands. Programming for it is quite fun, though you'll probably be more productive if you could download your rom onto it and use an emulator.


I'm going to eat you!
Me!
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 11:12 Edited at: 26th Sep 2005 11:13
no one uses AA any more?

thats it`s strong point, ever had a fancy rechargeable camera and had the battery go flat just when you wanted to use it?, same for mobile phones, with a removable battery you can carry spares, use rechargables, buy some from a stopover etc, manys the time I have cursed my 5 Megapixel camera cos just when I want a piccy it shuts down and demands a recharge, I`m in the middle of the countryside for crying out, where the hells the powerpoint , replacable batterys are the thing, it would be nice if mobile phones had replaceable batteries too, doesnt stop you buying some rechargeables for it anyway if thats what rocks your boat.



we know where area 51 is, but where are areas 1 to 50?, and what do they do there?.
Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 26th Sep 2005 14:14
Yes I agree, I've made my feelings clear on batteries for such things in previous posts. Rechargable non-removable batteries for devices such as games machines, cameras, muisc players etc are stupid, in-practical and inexcusable in any circumatance in my opinion! lol. The only reason I can think for a portable device them is in mobile phones or very high drainl laptops, but personally I'll never buy such a device where you can't buy areplacement spare battery to carry around just in case

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 01:33
Quote: " it need rechargable batterys......no one uses AA anymore xD"


Ever heard of rechargable AA battaries?


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
PiratSS
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 05:06
i'll probably be buying one in a few months

Raven
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 05:27
Quote: "You leap at people the second they say the new Revolution controller doesn't look comfortable, yet you claim this new machine isn't comfortable having never held it? You make quite the hypocrite I must say."


Not particularly. People were saying out-right that the Revolution controller was uncomfortable and horrible, I don't remember many people saying it "LOOKED" (the keyword in what I said) uncomfortable.

Besides while I might not have pick this particular machine up.. I find the GameBoy SP, PSP, Lynx and GameGear extremely uncomfortable, the last 2 in particular are far too heavy for me personally to use for more than a few minutes and that's what this reminds me of.

The Revolution controller on the other hand looks almost exactly like my DVD Remote, which I personally find extremely comfortable to use... and sit there with it in my hand without realising it.

You grip both very differently; and I'm sure there weight of the two is EXTREMELY different. The PSP itself edges on being a little too weighty for my likes. I've found it quite odd how the DS with more mass feels more comfortble and lighter. This said the DS is still quite far from being AS comfortable as the GameBoy Advance.

IMO that is single handedly the most comfortable portable gaming system there is. Just fits the hands nicely.. although I wish it was a bit larger, as do no doubt a few other people.

As far as Battery Packs go. I agree that the Sony PSP and the Apple iPod have horrible battery packs.. you'll find for the first month they'll last a reasonable amount of time (about 10hrs each) but after that they die to closer to 2-3hrs. Quite distressing that they can't be recharged often.

Another big mistake people make with Rechargable packs is they charge them up just enough to play first time, and also recharge them before fully dead. If you don't let Rechargable Batteries / Powerpacks fully charge and fully discharge the first few uses this can cripple the useage you get out of them.

The GameBoy Advance uses AA Batteries, but personally I use a Recharge Pack. You might not get the same 14hrs as you would from Duracell Ultra or such; (closer to 10hrs) but Nintendo's stuff seems to be very resiliant. Even 3rd Party stuff.. no doubt due to Nintendo forcing people to make sure it passes thier Seal of Approval, else you can't sell it.

Personally I find a system where a seal on a product will assure you, that it is a quality product is worth paying over the odds for.

It might be interesting getting one, if I had the free cash.. if only to tinker I probably would. Still it looks quite horrible, and don't think I'd be able to comfortable hold it. While I'm not expecting something of keeping up with the PSP, it would be nice to be able to use this generation technology.

As I said the Imageon and GoForce 3D are specifically designed mobile GPU, that use low-power and provide reasonable performance at lower resolutions.

GoForce3D 4500 for example is capable of similar graphics to the GeForce3 in-terms of performance and shaders. So if you couple that with an 400MHz PowerPC 750FX, and a full SDK. Developers could quite easily create titles of equal standing to stuff like Prince of Persia, and Unreal 2.

We're not talking Halo or Resident Evil 4... but still it wouldn't be that far behind the curve. They have to have created a custom mobo inside it anyways to take dual 200MHz x86. Perhaps not a custom BIOS or Chipset, but then IBM provide a range of Chipsets; and a BIOS is fairly simple (for anyone who can design a mobo that is) to put together.

I'd love to put my hand to making some set peice systems, if I had the money. : sighs : Problem is you need to really order bulk in order to get anything from companies; and well knowing how to create prefab blueprints probably wouldn't hurt either heh

TKF15H
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 05:57 Edited at: 27th Sep 2005 06:00
The GP32 has a RISC processor, I thought the GP2X would have one too. I haven't seen any references as which type of processor it uses though. I read about this a few months ago and they did mention a RISC rather than x86. The more I study the x86 processors the more I feel like I need to get a MAC while they're still PPC-based.

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the_winch
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 06:28
It uses ARM according to this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gp2x

Given what you would think the target audience is it's strange the site selling them is so short of info.
Raven
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 07:53
ah alright, I was assuming x86 given this is the most effective platform for Linux to run on. Did some digging and found another site that explains the architecture of it, might check up on the processors themselves later.

From the looks of it, there is only 2D Acceleration and that's purely CPU internal (MMP2, kinda like MMX for Intel). So it would go with the whole 'no 3D acceleration stuff'.

I agree given the market they serve it is oddly sparse.

Megaton Cat
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 08:17 Edited at: 27th Sep 2005 08:19
Quote: "People were saying out-right that the Revolution controller was uncomfortable and horrible, I don't remember many people saying it "LOOKED" (the keyword in what I said) uncomfortable."


Can you tell me the difference between these two skits?

Guy A: *Looks at picture of a blocky peice of barbed wire* Man. That thing is uncomfortable.

Guy B: *Looks at picture of a blocky peice of barbed wire* Man. The thing looks uncomfortable


My point is, it's all how people talk. Dozens of people did indeed say that the Revolution controller looked uncofortable.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
Raven
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Posted: 27th Sep 2005 08:54
It's not how all ppl talk, as I said I don't recall many people saying it looked uncomfortable.
Most said it was crap, because it looked like a TV Remote.

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