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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Yay, Abuse buttons!

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re faze
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Joined: 24th Sep 2004
Location: The shores of hell.
Posted: 5th Nov 2005 22:14 Edited at: 5th Nov 2005 22:16
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Quote: "Comments of a threatening nature"


good its time to get back at all of those ******* e-mail thugs

how do you threaten someone on the internet, what are you going to reach through my frickin modem and hit me?

I need someone intelligent to talk to me about my problems too...
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JoelJ
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Posted: 5th Nov 2005 22:30
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Quote: "For a Praise button, there must be some result to praise, i.e. stars. But on this site there's nothing to differentiate each user. If you want to praise somebody, why not send them an email?"

For example, Jimmy might make a person, lets say for example, Greed, Feel like he's a moron, I would think that's awesome, but Greed probably wont


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Dave J
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 00:10
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Quote: "How, may I ask?

It is one of the only few systems that DOESNT encourage abuse."


I can easily cut a deal with a couple people where we constantly praise eachother, or just as easily bribe someone for 'praise points'. Similarly, if I don't like someone I may deliberately not praise them no matter how useful their response (I'd imagine this would happen to Raven a lot). Also, people may start being judged on praise points alone, and then there's Joel's example. There are lots of issues with such a system and we have discussed them several times before.


"Computers are useless, they can only give you answers."
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 00:11 Edited at: 6th Nov 2005 00:11
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Quoting Exeat:
Quote: "You don't need to know, just click the report button if you think someone is abusing you. It should be pretty evident because you'll probably feel offended in someway."


Quoting Richard Davey:
Quote: "Sure, but if you feel like YOU'VE been abused, then you will know about it. If that other person "didn't mean it to sound that way" then they'll learn from it too (because if we agree it was abusive, they'll have a week ban to think it over). It's time to be a bit more considerate to others around here."


I rarely get offended expecially in messages... I just wanted to voice that we may be opening Pandoras Box. There are many newbies that get offended easily by the non-newbies. Of course it's not up to me weither we have it or not... I just know that I will never use it.

Quoting Jeku:
Quote: "For a Praise button, there must be some result to praise, i.e. stars. But on this site there's nothing to differentiate each user. If you want to praise somebody, why not send them an email?

Also, praise can be subjective. Something awesome from one member might be sub-par to another. But abuse is pretty black and white (hopefully). If you break the rule, then bang, you're punished."


I like the idea of a praise button... but one that's only accessable by the poster of the thread. Like if a newbie posts a question and 4 people post messages yet only 2 of those people actually help the newbie then the newbie can hit the praise button on those two messages that helped them. The "praise" is added to the rank of the users account. As the rank goes up so does his/her title... titles start at "Newbie" (when the rank is zero). What the rest of the titles would be and how many would be up to TGC's.

The titles of course would be where we see "User" under each persons name (people that aren't a Mod or part of TGC's).
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Sephnroth
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 06:12
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Quote: "
Sephnroth: have you ever been to a form where they have POST COUNT and USER RATINGS and stuff like that?

people join the forums, and start posting in EVERY thread, and starting all this spammy crap.

it doesnt work, trust me
"


i already addressed post counts and why those suck, I also made sure i underlined how praise is different. There are also multiudes of examples where such a system wworks, I linked to one of them.

It doesnt encourage people to ignore anyone, simply because anyone who answers a question for someone then deserves praise, it doesnt make the answer any less valid. Of course its no good for a forum like geek talk, its designed for forums based around programming Q&A. It also encourages people to post a reply with a thoughour answer instead of what we are seeing more of which tends to go along the lines "rtfm NOOOOOBBB!!11!!!1!ONE" and such like.

If rich doesnt want to implement it thats cool, its his forum, will have to see what it has in mind. But the system CAN work and DOES work in many other places. Its not another post count, post counts give you praise for posting spam, in this scenario you get absolutly nothing for spamming.

DarkSDK/WinAPI Tutorial
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 15:28
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The "praise" system I have in mind is based around a members contributions to the community as a whole, not just in the forum.

I won't go into too much detail here, because I don't want people speculating over the granularities of something that's still just a concept on paper.

But in essence I imagine the "rating" appearing sort of like stripes do on Generals. This all links in with the new showcase system (on the new site). If someone releases a showcase worthy game, they get an uber-star in their profile. Minor stars are also given for things like codebase entries, tutorial submissions, media (models, music, etc), DLL releases, a good round of bug reporting, etc.

This requires changes to all of the core areas of the site, but that's ok because it is happening anyway, and has been in development for 6+ months now.

In essence, I want to "reward" people who actively contribute to the community, not who just talk in a forum. Consider it an "activity" rating. I will most likely allow thread owners to rate a respondant (no negative ratings), but the value of that rating will be insignificant compared to say having a top-viewed codebase entry, or a newsletter featured game.

Someone who releases many showcase worthy games, or top user-rated tutorials, would appear as having a higher "rating" (although I hate that term).

It will sort out the "talkers" from the "do'ers" - something that is far more valuable to us. You will be able to look at someone and see "this guy is a top-rated tutorial author with several showcase worthy game releases under his belt", therefore I can trust that he knows what he's talking about when it comes to programming.

This I feel is much more useful than "he replies a lot, and people like what he says".

Cheers,

Rich

People don't quit playing because they grow old. They grow old because they quit playing.

http://www.corephp.co.uk
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soapyfish
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 15:38
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^^^^^^^^^^

Sounds great.


When the power of love overcomes the love of power... The world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 15:58
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I don't see why we even need a rating.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
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Benjamin
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 16:02
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Says the person who would permanently have the lowest. I quite like the idea..

Tempest - P2P UDP Multiplayer Plugin - 45% - Integration is going well!
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 16:37 Edited at: 6th Nov 2005 16:39
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Are you kidding? If we had a rating system I would be getting ALL the votes. I don't want to make it unfair for the other users. Atleast give them a chance.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
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TDP Enterprises
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 16:45
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i say every one in the ANJL automatically gets a boost in their rating









But anyways, a rating system *might* cause me to think some of my more sarcastic posts through a tad more...

"You can't expect to weild supreme executive power just because some watery t**t throws a bl***y sword at you..."
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MiR
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 18:04
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Sounds like a great idea. Just got to wait for it to be put into action now...(twiddles thumbs)

My signature has been erased by me because it's LARGE.
Thank you for the votez!1!
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Lost in Thought
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Location: U.S.A. : Douglas, Georgia
Posted: 6th Nov 2005 18:42
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Quote: "In essence, I want to "reward" people who actively contribute to the community, not who just talk in a forum. Consider it an "activity" rating. I will most likely allow thread owners to rate a respondant (no negative ratings), but the value of that rating will be insignificant compared to say having a top-viewed codebase entry, or a newsletter featured game.

Someone who releases many showcase worthy games, or top user-rated tutorials, would appear as having a higher "rating" (although I hate that term).

It will sort out the "talkers" from the "do'ers" - something that is far more valuable to us. You will be able to look at someone and see "this guy is a top-rated tutorial author with several showcase worthy game releases under his belt", therefore I can trust that he knows what he's talking about when it comes to programming.

This I feel is much more useful than "he replies a lot, and people like what he says"."


Go ahead and put me down for the lowest rating. I help people so much on and off the forum, I will probably never finish anything of my own anyway LOL. I will finish the csm importer example. Assuming Mike gets the DBP update with the new collision system released one day as I want to make a version using just DBP code for collision instead of NGC, and APEX gets his importer updated

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ThinkDigital
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 19:50
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It's a very good idea. Ranking users by how much they contribute to the community, not how many posts they have or how often they're around the forums.

"Use the force, Luke."
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re faze
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 19:56
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so i WILL get to become a brigidier mod one day

I need someone intelligent to talk to me about my problems too...
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Damokles
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 20:00
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The only problem I see with such a rating would be here :
- If somebody who didn't contribute much has good experience even if he didn' contribute, then people will not take him as seriously as a forum-contributor.

- Mind the gap -
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Peter H
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 20:26
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I think we need a button to report abusive use of the abuse button.

"We make the worst games in the universe."

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ThinkDigital
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Posted: 6th Nov 2005 21:28
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But abusively using the abuse button is abuse, right? So use the abuse button for that. No, wait...

Nevermind, just ignore me.

"Use the force, Luke."
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 01:36
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Quote: "The "praise" system I have in mind is based around a members contributions to the community as a whole, not just in the forum."


Cool! I praise the praise system!
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Me!
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 09:54
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to all those praise system naysayers, get over it , I would be affected as much as any "non-contributer" since I almost always reply to posts I can help in and supply working snippets of code that people can try or not as they wish, but even though I answer a lot of posts and supply code, by the criteria mentioned I wouldn`t get ranked since I don`t post full programs, WIPs or twenty liners etc, and it doesn`t bother me one jot, I don`t come here for brownie points, just to chat with like minded people and help out, despite my low ranking all people have to do is cut`n`paste the snippet to see if it does what I say, then they can make their own mind up.



if there is one thing I can NOT tolerate, it`s intolerant people.
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Jiffy
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 10:29 Edited at: 7th Nov 2005 10:42
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Me! - That may be true, but it would (to me) be a little judgemental. I mean, I actively post in the FPSC boards (something that gets harder and harder every day ), but I of course barely ever really contribute to the extent of the criteria. It's not that I don't mind having a low "rating", but I just think it feels a little uncomfortable when everyone has a bunch of uber-stars and I have one little mini-star. It just seems that people may take you slight bit less seriously if you don't have any stars as opposed to having a bunch of 'em. Anyway, it's Rich's choice, so bring on the praise system!


Click above for Project Luna demo! Resident Evil Remake is teh fergin' best!
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 11:47
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Quote: "If somebody who didn't contribute much has good experience even if he didn' contribute, then people will not take him as seriously as a forum-contributor."


Which is pretty much what happens now anyway - so there'd be no change there then The onus will be on you to demonstrate your skills rather than just talk about them. There is a marked difference.

Quote: "It just seems that people may take you slight bit less seriously if you don't have any stars as opposed to having a bunch of 'em."


I'm afraid that is how it *should* be though! It someone is really as good as their talk, they should prove it through code snippets, WIPs, releases, well rated forum posts, etc etc. If they aren't able to actually demonstrate it, then someone has every right to assume they're all talk, no walk. Forum posts will count towards an overall rating, just not as significantly as other activities will.

People don't quit playing because they grow old. They grow old because they quit playing.

http://www.corephp.co.uk
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 15:53
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I noticed yesterday, the abuse buttons are being "abused" already.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 16:19 Edited at: 7th Nov 2005 16:20
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How exactly? Having seen what has been reported I think it's fine so far. Or are you talking about the complaint made against you? (that I've yet to decide upon, but your comments looked somewhat uncalled for at first glance)

People don't quit playing because they grow old. They grow old because they quit playing.

http://www.corephp.co.uk
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Hawkeye
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 16:59
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Quote: " The only problem I see with such a rating would be here :
- If somebody who didn't contribute much has good experience even if he didn' contribute, then people will not take him as seriously as a forum-contributor"

*agrees*

Moby Dick as blog - Arrr! Blog spotted over teh starboard side, after him mehearties!
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Damokles
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 17:54
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So to be taken seriously, I should publish the lessons I give at school ?

- Mind the gap -
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 18:02
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It would be a start. What use is knowledge locked in the head of one person?

People don't quit playing because they grow old. They grow old because they quit playing.

http://www.corephp.co.uk
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Drew Cameron
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 18:34
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Sounds like a good idea that you've thought through well.

Dumbo & Cool - 10.
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Damokles
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 18:51
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Quote: "It would be a start. What use is knowledge locked in the head of one person?"

Hmmm, maybe to take over the world ... Well ... Maybe.
I will see if I can translate them.

- Mind the gap -
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Grog Grueslayer
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 20:28
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Quote: "It just seems that people may take you slight bit less seriously if you don't have any stars as opposed to having a bunch of 'em. "


That's good though. When I first came here I used to see the joined date as weither the person posting was a newbie or not... but I quickly learned that's not a good way to judge the knowledge of the poster. It didn't take long before some guy that joined 2 years ago posted like a newbie that didn't know the most basic commands.

Also this praise system will help motivate all of us to learn to code better to help newbies and non-newbies alike.
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 20:54
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Quote: "Or are you talking about the complaint made against you?"


No, I meant people hitting the report button repeatedly just becuase they don't get an instant response the first time.

And the baby whining stuff ofcourse.


The future is here, and I can't afford it.
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re faze
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 21:59
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how many abuse reports does it take to get someone banned?

I need someone intelligent to talk to me about my problems too...
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Freddy 007
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 22:02
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I guess it depends... It depends on who it is, what they did, and the reason they did it, and so on. Try for yourself

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Lost in Thought
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Posted: 7th Nov 2005 22:55
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Yeah let us know lol

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Phaelax
DBPro Master
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Posted: 8th Nov 2005 00:18
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Anyone else as tempted as I am to just press that little red button under Rich's post?


Deadly Night Assassins
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Peter H
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Posted: 8th Nov 2005 00:35
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lol, i wasn't until you mentioned the thought... now i am irresistably drawn to the button

"We make the worst games in the universe."

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JoelJ
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Posted: 8th Nov 2005 03:28
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Quote: "how many abuse reports does it take to get someone banned?"

try reading, he already said in this thread

it just depends...


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re faze
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Posted: 8th Nov 2005 03:30
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how was the ban? get any schoolwork done?

I need someone intelligent to talk to me about my problems too...
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Jimmy
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Posted: 18th Nov 2005 07:51 Edited at: 18th Nov 2005 07:59
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hey merranvo's boyfriend, how was getting a brain? get any brains done? OH, you didn't GET a brain?? oh that's too bad. NO BRAIN.


Bloggy
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