Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

Geek Culture / 2008 Text Adventure Compo Planning [NOT the contest thread!]

Author
Message
Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 4th May 2008 03:27
Summer is almost here, so for the third consecutive year I'm starting the planning phase of our annual Text Adventure Competition in a Geek Culture thread. This is not the official contest thread; the competition is not officially starting yet! As always, I'm making a GC thread to discuss the rules for the competition and to get some input from the community as to how everyone wants it to be run.

Last year, we had some pretty harsh rules that kept a lot of people from entering. I'd gotten emails from people commenting on how they were confusing or overly complex, so I'm thinking about dropping a lot of rules and making this year's contest the most laid-back of them all. We'll still have the grand prize, issued to the overall best game, and multiple kudos categories as well. But the rules themselves will be loosened dramatically, so the contest is a bit less exclusive; more open to less experienced developers.

As for the rules themselves, here's a very rough draft of the rules I'm considering for the 2008 competition:

Entries must be in English (any widely-used form is fine; both US and UK spellings are acceptable)

Entries must be made using at least one tool sold/ distributed officially by TGC

Judges must classify the game as a proper Text Adventure/ IF game. Unlike previous competitions, you can use whatever media you want, but keep in mind that judges can decide if a game is a text adventure or not! So don't try to enter a 2D scroller with a text field and try to claim it's an IF game

The legal mumbo jumbo rules apply as usual; you can't use copyrighted materials, judges/ employees of TGC and/ or prize furbishers, etc. can't enter, all of that fun stuff

I decided to ditch the media rule entirely this time around. Every year it seems to be the most "controversial" rule, and causes the most confusion. I'd imagine that some people are going to love this, and some people will hate it, and that's why this thread exists, hehe. I'm also opening up the development gates fully, allowing IF engines and everything else (the stipulation being that *something* in your game has to be made with TGC software). Judging for the grand prize will remain the same... originality, story development, and writing ability will be judged. So you even if you did try to pass off a scroller or an FPS, it wouldn't amount to much anyway . We'll judge other categories of course, but those others will only apply to the Kudos award, and nothing else (IE, they won't affect your score for the grand prize).

As for the Kudos prizes, I'm not sure what to include this year. The usual suspects will return, and I'm thinking about adding a few new ones as well. Here's the list as I have it now:

Old Kudos (including one Kudos for each grand prize judging category)
Best Media: The game with the highest-quality (and best use of) media

Most Addictive Game: The game the judges couldn't stop playing

Best GUI: best/ most practical/ most well-organized GUI

Retail Award: The game we'd be most willing to pay for

New Kudos
The 2008 TGC Poet Laureate: The entry with the most distinguished writing; present us with your absolute mastery of the English Language

Best Soundtrack: for the game with the best soundtrack, sound effects, etc.

Best Protagonist(s): Awarded to the game with the coolest good guys

Best Antagonist(s): Awarded to the game with the bad guys we love to hate

Best Environment: Awarded to the game with the most highly detailed, most expansive game world

Anyway, this is how I'm thinking about structuring this year's contest. It will most likely begin in early June and end in the middle of October. Everyone is invited to participate in the conversation and discuss what rules you like or dislike, and to offer up your own ideas about how the competition should be structured. I'm looking forward to playing lots of really fun IF games this fall!

Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 4th May 2008 04:59
Ooh goody, I'm getting ideas already. Rules seem fair to me...

Though, I'm not sure with the whole media thing, if I missed anything, my apologies, but would I be able to use other people's music with their permission, as you're judging the soundtrack. I'm not a good music maker.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Virtual Nomad
Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Dec 2005
Location: SF Bay Area, USA
Posted: 4th May 2008 05:04
can we start with explaining what an "IF" game is? i know what text adventures are, but IF is a new one to me

Virtual Nomad
AMD XP 1800+ (~1.6 Ghz) / 1.5 GB RAM
ATI Radeon 8700LE 128 MB / Windows XP
Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 4th May 2008 05:11 Edited at: 4th May 2008 05:13
IF = Interactive Fiction

Which is probably the more politically correct term for a 'text adventure', as not all IFs have an adventure or are made of just text.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Virtual Nomad
Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Dec 2005
Location: SF Bay Area, USA
Posted: 4th May 2008 06:10
interesting. thanks

Virtual Nomad
AMD XP 1800+ (~1.6 Ghz) / 1.5 GB RAM
ATI Radeon 8700LE 128 MB / Windows XP
Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 4th May 2008 06:24
Thanks for the definition Sep . Yeah, they're the same thing, I should have elaborated on that hehe.

I don't see any problem with using media made by others, so long as you have permission to use it. And make sure the creator knows what you're using it for of course

Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 4th May 2008 17:42
The new media rules sound good - should encourage more people to enter. The only danger is, as you noted, that people may end up moving into non-text adventure type games. But as long as you're fairly sensible about what you'll accept as a text-adventure, it should be okay.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Tom J
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Aug 2005
Location: Essex, England
Posted: 4th May 2008 18:05
Its this time of year again already? Last years didn't seem that long ago to me... well I think I'll enter this time round instead :p

Only suggestion is don't go too over the top with all the kudos awards, before you know for sure how many will be entering... everyone could be a winner if 8 people or less enter
Aertic
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 4th May 2008 18:38
Quote: "Entries must be made using at least one tool sold/ distributed officially by TGC"


I wonder if a fpsc user is going to use fpsc to complete his/hers game...
Its a wild thought, but hey, it is possible.

Zotoaster
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 20th Dec 2004
Location: Scotland
Posted: 4th May 2008 18:39
Call me ignorant, but I'm not entirely sure on the definition of a text adventure. Does this basically mean you type commands like "forward, back, open", etc. and have your character visually follow them, or have stories with perhaps pictures you help you visualise things, and when it comes to choices you type things?

Sounds cool either way.

Don't you just hate that Zotoaster guy?
Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 4th May 2008 19:18
Basically, there are two kinds:

Type 1)
You get a paragraph or so describing the scene: "You're standing in a room. There is a dog sitting on the floor."
Then you get a command line where you can type stuff in. So you might type "pet dog" and you'd go to another screen which says "You pet the dog..." etc. Or you might type "kick dog" at which point you might go to a screen that says "You heartless person!" or something. This interface is difficult to get right because of the complexity of the english language and the number of synonyms - also, it's not always clear what options the player has.

Type 2)
You get your "You're standing in a room. There is a dog sitting on the floor." paragraph. Then you get a list of options:
"1) Pet dog
2) Kick dog
3) Leave the room" etc. Then you press the corresponding button (or type the button and press enter) and you go to the next screen.
I prefer this method because it's simpler for both player and developer. But, if you had - for example - a spell-casting system where you have to speak magic words in a particular combination to formulate a spell, you might want the text-parser one.

Of course, there are probably other ways to do this: perhaps having a bank of words you've picked up by talking to people and clicking on the word bank to choose what to talk about? I suppose that could be classed as a text adventure, as long as it then had the resulting scene described using text.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 4th May 2008 20:06
Quote: "I prefer this method because it's simpler for both player and developer. "


Agreed, the text-parser system made it difficult for me to work out how to move around as a player without being a developer (I've played around with an IF engine) thus I'm sticking with the second system. "drive car"..."command not understood", "get in car"..."command not understood"...moments later you realise the right word was 'ride'. Plus the fact I've already programmed most of my text engine - I think I'm going to try and create an editor for it as well.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 4th May 2008 20:54
Quote: "I prefer this method because it's simpler for both player and developer. "


That second option kind of defeats the purpose of a text adventure. Contests aren't supposed to be "simple", are they? In my opinion the entrant should have to build a proper text parser like last year, instead of resorting to clicking on "Go in car", "Walk left" etc. The second option offers absolutely *no* challenge in any shape or form. You could build your game in a webpage


Zotoaster
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 20th Dec 2004
Location: Scotland
Posted: 4th May 2008 21:01
OK, thanks for clearing that up for me. I think the first one would be a lot more interesting to make. Commands don't necesarly have to have only a given set of keywords in a certain order, i.e. "ride", but a list, for example, "ride/drive/go in car". Also gives you a means to show off with. There is nothing that will get me to be impressed by the second one, heheh.

Don't you just hate that Zotoaster guy?
Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 4th May 2008 21:33 Edited at: 4th May 2008 21:35
Quote: "The second option offers absolutely *no* challenge in any shape or form."


From a developer's standpoint you have a point (though I guess any engine could potentially be awful to code) but I think that, from the player's point of view, it's no more difficult than those old point n' clicks (but with all the clickable things sort of flagged up). And if you have a separate inventory system (so it doesn't actually tell you when you need to use an inventory item) then you have the potential for a challenging game.

But, if done well, the parser system could easily be the most immersive, and give far greater freedom.

Quote: "You could build your game in a webpage"

True. You've got me there.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Aertic
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 4th May 2008 21:38
Wait?
Just wondering, could you use FPSCreator?
I just had an Idea pop into my head, thats all, and I still yet have to try out DBC and learn C++.
But I was just wondering...

Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 4th May 2008 22:01
I dunno Jeku, it seems to me the main focus is on the writing rather than the engine. But, I suppose you'd score more for a more elaborate engine - what I've pre-prepared is a little basic, and I am currently coding an editor for it and it isn't taking too long to code, as I personally want to focus on the writing itself more. But, yes it's a game making forum, not an IF one, hence it'd be good to give points on the construction of the engine as well as the adventure itself. Perhaps I'll make the thing more complex once I get started properly.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Jeku
Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Jul 2003
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Posted: 4th May 2008 22:33
Quote: "it seems to me the main focus is on the writing rather than the engine."


Actually you're quite right. The developer in me is being too technical perhaps Yes, since the story is the main focus, the second method might be possible. I just cringe when I think of people making spaghetti-code programs with thousands of gigantic if-else statements and gotos

Perhaps you could join the methods and do something like those old classic LucasArts adventure games? Day of the Tentacle had a bunch of action verbs on the bottom of the screen--- open, pick up, talk to, etc. so if you wanted to open a drawer you'd click Open then you'd click the drawer. In that case it makes it less cumbersome from the user's point of view than typing into a console window, but still gives a lot of flexibility for the programmer.


Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 4th May 2008 22:40
As for parsers versus listed option, we've always allowed both, but most people go for the parser system because it's more complex, and you can earn more originality points doing something neat with a parser.

I was thinking about an expansion to the general rules. Every year someone asks why we don't judge technical perfection, and my answer is always that this competition always leans more toward game design than anything else. But it seems that a lot of entrants like this compo because of the technical aspects, so I dunno... let me know what you guys like: do you like the storywriting and game design element of the competition, or would you prefer it if technical "skill" were weighed in the overall scoring?

Quote: "Its this time of year again already?"

I was thinking the same thing! Like there was a massive gap between the 2006 and 2007 compos, and a tiny one this year. I think it's because we moved the competition later into the year last time around, ending it in October, so it sort of feels like we just wrapped up the last one, hehe.

Quote: "Just wondering, could you use FPSCreator?"

You could, but you'll want to be careful about how you create your game. If a judge decides your game truly belongs to some other genre, but is hiding under the cover of a text adventure game, then it'll most likely be disqualified.

The text needs to be the primary focus of the game. The story, environment, etc. should all be described through text, and judging will be based entirely on the originality, story development, and writing ability. These will only affect the game's actual text. If we include a technical category in the general scoring this year, it would apply to the delivery of text, the player input method used, etc. and would not be based on or affected by media aspects of your game. In other words, a game with white text on a black background can easily beat a game with gorgeous graphics and audio. In fact, this has been the case previously... last year's grand prize winner, Duality, was simple in design with black and white text. And the winner in 2006, Melody Machine, didn't use media either... and had black and white text . I'm not saying we favor black and white text, but the story and design are what really matter. Unless we expand the rules to include the technical aspect, but that'd mostly have to do with the complexity of the input system I think.

Quote: "don't go too over the top with all the kudos awards, before you know for sure how many will be entering... everyone could be a winner if 8 people or less enter"

Eh, if we do include a bunch, we'll end up with certain games winning multiple kudos awards . It happened like that last year... Duality won the grand prize, and if my memory serves me correctly, it went on to win three or four kudos awards as well, lol.

Maybe this year we can look into getting some Kudos "ribbons" or "trophies" made up... 2D images of course Maybe two for each, so you can have a bigger one (like 400x400 pixels) and a smaller one (50x50) for your avatars, signatures, decorating websites, etc. Dunno, just an idea. I don't want to ask Dink from MISoft to do them though, he has enough on his plate right now lol. And if I make them, they'll come out of MS Paint hahaha.

Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 4th May 2008 22:43
Not a bad idea, when Darth Kiwi was talking about combining the two, I was thinking of the old SCUMM games.

Quote: "I just cringe when I think of people making spaghetti-code programs with thousands of gigantic if-else statements and gotos"


Hehe, that would be a mess, so it wouldn't be beneficial on that level - it would be quite tedious, at least a basic scripting system (using LUA) and your own basic editor covers that problem and makes it a lot easier to make changes and to built top on.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Aertic
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 4th May 2008 22:45
Quote: "You could, but you'll want to be careful about how you create your game. If a judge decides your game truly belongs to some other genre, but is hiding under the cover of a text adventure game, then it'll most likely be disqualified."


Sounds risky, but I have just invented brilliant textures for fpsc use that look better than crysis in someways...
I'll give a little shot, but I dont think I might enter.

David R
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Sep 2003
Location: 3.14
Posted: 4th May 2008 22:46 Edited at: 4th May 2008 22:50
Quote: "In my opinion the entrant should have to build a proper text parser like last year, instead of resorting to clicking on "Go in car", "Walk left" etc. The second option offers absolutely *no* challenge in any shape or form. You could build your game in a webpage
"


Seconded, if I were to enter, I would love to jump in and make a pretty string parser class, make it ultra flexible etc..... ahhh, the challenges I could have with that *sighs*

Which brings me to the question, how far can I stretch the "Made with a TGC product/tool" part? Can I just use a single TGC made tool and then use a totally different engine etc., considering this is judged on written content and not really the dev. side?

Since it'd be an ideal little project I could work on for quick bursts between exams (and I have a grand total of about 9 hours of cont. prose writing exams this year, so it'd be good pratice)

EDIT:
Also, is it appropriate to use audio to quite an extensive degree?(for atmospheric purpose, etc.) Although the text would obviously describe a great deal of the surroundings etc., I reckon audio would add an extra layer of immersion.


09-f9-11-02-9d-74-e3-5b-d8-41-56-c5-63-56-88-c0
Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 4th May 2008 23:05
Quote: "how far can I stretch the "Made with a TGC product/tool" part? Can I just use a single TGC made tool and then use a totally different engine etc., considering this is judged on written content and not really the dev. side?"

I think that should be fine... so long as *something* in the game was made with TGC software . We'll probably ask contestants to list the tools they used in developing their games (and maybe how they were used). But we wouldn't give preference to a game made in DBP over a game made in XNA when it came to scoring. As long as it relates to TGC in some way, it's all good hehe.

Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 5th May 2008 01:56
Quote: "It happened like that last year... Duality won the grand prize, and if my memory serves me correctly, it went on to win three or four kudos awards as well, lol."

Hehe, yeah, I think I won four copies of Eternal Equinox Matt offered to give me 4 different activation codes, but I thought 1 would be fine.

Quote: "I just cringe when I think of people making spaghetti-code programs with thousands of gigantic if-else statements and gotos"

Seconded! I think I'll be using the simpler system (I'm more a storyteller than a coder) but I'm going to store each "page"'s details in an array etc.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Virtual Nomad
Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 14th Dec 2005
Location: SF Bay Area, USA
Posted: 5th May 2008 02:11
is there a link somewhere to last year's submissions and/or discussion?

Virtual Nomad
AMD XP 1800+ (~1.6 Ghz) / 1.5 GB RAM
ATI Radeon 8700LE 128 MB / Windows XP
Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 5th May 2008 02:16
When will the contest start? Also, will it be theme based? (sorry I didn't follow last years) I've already started fleshing out ideas and applying them - so far it's simple, but I'm actually liking the system as I'm getting used (with my rudimentary editor) to it and allows me to write in the story more freely - perhaps I won't go for something more complex.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
puppyofkosh
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Jan 2007
Location:
Posted: 5th May 2008 02:20
hmm...I have never done anything like this and it seems interesting. I might enter...

Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 5th May 2008 03:30 Edited at: 5th May 2008 03:31
Quote: "is there a link somewhere to last year's submissions and/or discussion?"

2006 Text Adventure Competition; 2006 "Winner's Circle" thread

2007 Text Adventure Competition

Quote: "When will the contest start? Also, will it be theme based?"

I'm going to contact Rick at TGC about it in late May, and we'll start it in the first week of June (not sure of the exact date yet). It'll run until Mid-October. You don't have to start your projects when the competition starts, but that's the earliest any entries will be accepted. There won't be a theme; your game can be about anything you want . If it's fan fiction, make sure you have permission to make the game, use elements of the story, etc. (I'm not sure about the legality of fan fiction and stuff, I assume it's fine in freeware games but check to make sure before you make something).

Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 5th May 2008 05:59
Excellent! I just realised from reading my next year assignments that I have to write an IF, so that's always a bonus - always good to get the practice and preparation in. (Apparently the purpose is to give writers an experience in the narrative in computer games, so that's cool)

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Gil Galvanti
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Dec 2004
Location: Texas, United States
Posted: 5th May 2008 06:02
I'm thinking I'll try again to enter this year, last year I couldn't get Escape from Alendar done in time, but I've got a good engine working with it now, and plenty of time left, so I'll give it a shot .


Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 5th May 2008 20:03
I just messaged you over MINet Sep . That has to be the coolest school assignment I've ever heard of hehe, we never had stuff like that.

Awesome Gil, can't wait to see it! I'm hoping the lessened rules will bring in the games that weren't finished for last year's competition. I'm looking at you Dazzag, Your MUD sounded like a lot of fun

Dazzag
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 26th Aug 2002
Location: Cyprus
Posted: 6th May 2008 13:46
Quote: "I'm looking at you Dazzag, Your MUD sounded like a lot of fun"
Heh, I got a small demo going just after the comp finished, but as usual other ideas and my interest in the MUD caused me to slack somewhat. Only time I tried it out was with John (Synergy bloke). Worked pretty well I seem to remember with one or two teething problems. Ok so is really only stomping around a map and talking to other people (battle system was almost done though), and looking at location pictures, but seemed to do it pretty well. Seriously wanted to include the abilility to create your own online MUD adventure for people to play too.

Perhaps I will dust it off and do a WIP. If enough interest then may continue with it. At the end of the day I could post it right now and the alpha demo should work. Hmmm. Will think about it. Just have to decide how much exactly I want to sink into it considering other things, including something really different I'm bunging together right now which is amazingly (and typically) much more fun. Love the easy peasy multiplayer aspect though of DarkMUD...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
Mr Makealotofsmoke
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2006
Location: BillTown (Well Aust)
Posted: 6th May 2008 14:00
i would so do this if i had DB


Free Webhosting = http://unlhosting.info --Send support ticket to get ad free
dan958
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Feb 2008
Location:
Posted: 6th May 2008 19:39
I might try this, except mine will be very basic

Your signature has been erased by a mod because it's larger than 600x120
Agent Dink
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Mar 2004
Location:
Posted: 6th May 2008 20:21
This could be fun... I might have to enter this. We'll see

Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 6th May 2008 20:32
The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of a prize for technical brilliance. The DarkMUD sounds like it'll brush off any other contenders on the engine-design-front, and I'd really like to see a well-implemented, easy to use synonym-filled parser system where you hardly ever have to guess at words.

Story would still be important - and that's the aspect I'm aiming for - but I think technical ability ought to be considered as well.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Aertic
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Jul 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 6th May 2008 20:42
Quote: "would so do this if i had DB"


You could use fpsc, it may be a tad hard though, also how about DarkGDK?

Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 6th May 2008 21:34
Quote: "The DarkMUD sounds like it'll brush off any other contenders on the engine-design-front, and I'd really like to see a well-implemented, easy to use synonym-filled parser system where you hardly ever have to guess at words."


Don't say that, I want to be able to go with something simple and still win. Without a strong enough engine I'll really have to make my writing superior and I can't do that.

Just messing with you, the way mine works is simple, but I plan to have a parser and define all of the possible actions via the script, I dunno (Something like: Select 'Go' then followed by 'to the bedroom' would be parsed to see if such an action were possible). Though I'm still contemplating on how I'd get a good inventory system going...just noting things to myself, so ignore it if it's irrelevant to anything, now that I'm thinking about it, perhaps store the inventory variables in a separate save file and only allow specific 'options' to show when the item is equipped. [not exactly a technical note to self, but no doubt one I'll forget before I get back onto it]

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Dazzag
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 26th Aug 2002
Location: Cyprus
Posted: 6th May 2008 23:22
Quote: "The DarkMUD sounds like it'll brush off any other contenders on the engine-design-front"
Doubt it. Apart from the MUDiness of it then so far is pretty simple. Login, select an adventure, move around, talk to people, look at online pictures of locations, and thats about it when I left it (apart from a half finished battle system). Parser is pretty rubbish currently. And considering I am having loads of fun on a couple of new projects, I don't know if I will get back to making it better.

Oh and as for good parsers, we talked about this last time. Some of the best adventures back in the day were well complicated. Things like "Pick up rope then use it with the clasp to tie the boat to the pier and then go north" were pretty much possible. Yikes...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 6th May 2008 23:37
Blimey, well it'll be interesting to see if anybody pulls of a parser like that.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 8th May 2008 01:10
I do remember reading that people developed parsers that would understand, for example, "pick up everything except the feather" which I thought was just astonishing.

I guess part of the problem is synonyms: multiple words could have multiple meanings. Like "feed rat" has a totally different meaning to "feed rat to dog". The other hurdle would be syntax, I suppose: making the engine understand to break up the list of instructions at each "then" and understanding what "except" and "to" mean.

Quote: "Don't say that, I want to be able to go with something simple and still win. Without a strong enough engine I'll really have to make my writing superior and I can't do that. "

Storyline and writing should also be praised along with technical achievement - but I don't think your writing needs to be poet laureate standard: a fantastic plot sometimes needs only very basic, matter of fact writing.

Quote: "Doubt it. Apart from the MUDiness of it then so far is pretty simple."

Well, I for one am pretty impressed: I never delved into any kind if multiplayer so I have no idea how any of that stuff works, except in the vaguest sense.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 8th May 2008 02:58
Quote: "Quote: "Don't say that, I want to be able to go with something simple and still win. Without a strong enough engine I'll really have to make my writing superior and I can't do that. "
Storyline and writing should also be praised along with technical achievement - but I don't think your writing needs to be poet laureate standard: a fantastic plot sometimes needs only very basic, matter of fact writing."


I know, I'm just joking around.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 8th May 2008 05:01
But everyone should note the Poet Laureate game would most likely win above the most technically-superior game, as the scoring stands that is . I figured I should throw in that the scores are based on a 0.0-10.0 scale, and that the four scores are averaged to make your total score. Some people reading this may not be familiar with the competition or might not have been here in 2006 or 2007, so I figured I'd mention it hehe.

Dazzag
22
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 26th Aug 2002
Location: Cyprus
Posted: 8th May 2008 08:50
Heh, my original idea (allowing users to create their own MUD adventures that everyone can play) had the cunning plan of getting all the users to provide my storylines. I really only had a simple Darkplace MUD in my mind. Sigh, so many plans, so little time...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
Current fave quote : "She was like a candle in the wind.... unreliable...."
Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 11th May 2008 18:25
What sort of HUD do you think we'll be allowed to use this year? I remember that last year we were allowed a HUD but it had to be entirely text-based. I'm having a go at building my entry (in between revision sessions ) and there are some stats that will be used in-game that need to be displayed to the player, but I'm not sure whether to use a meter or a bit of text that says "You are feeling almost dead" or the like.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Tom J
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Aug 2005
Location: Essex, England
Posted: 11th May 2008 19:46
How long should the game be?
Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 11th May 2008 19:58 Edited at: 11th May 2008 20:08
EDIT - sorry, got confused with another thread.

I think last year's weren't *too* long - my entry would have taken about fifteen minutes to go through, as long as you knew what you were doing and read as little text as possible - but, of course, the text-reading makes up the majority of game-time. I think they even allowed you to enter a semi-finished game if you ran out of time, and it would be judged on what was there, though I'm not sure if anyone did that. Rami's entry was Jarod's Fall (please correct me and/or shoot me if I'm wrong) and that took a fair bit of time to complete - often due to the fact that it contained combat. I think, though, that as long as you have some semblance of a text-adventure, the length won't matter that much.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Seppuku Arts
Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Aug 2004
Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 11th May 2008 20:08
Half an hour? Hope that isn't the limit, I've probably already got about 10 minutes worth (though it does need redrafting at the moment) of course, I'm including how long it takes me to read the description.

Considering those 10 minutes are only a small bit (Prologue and the exploration between a house, housing estate and the bridge to town), I don't think I'll be doing the full epic of what I had in mind, but perhaps the first few 'chapters' and do the rest of the game separate.

"Experience never provides its judgments with true or strict universality; but only (through induction) with assumed and comparative universality." - Immanuel Kant
Darth Kiwi
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 7th Jan 2005
Location: On the brink of insanity.
Posted: 11th May 2008 20:11
Hehe, yeah, sorry about that half-an-hour post I made - I thought I was posting on a different thread. Ah, the thrill and risk of being a forum junkie... kind of.

I'm not actually a Kiwi, I just randomly thought it up one day.
Matt Rock
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Mar 2005
Location: Binghamton NY USA
Posted: 11th May 2008 20:30
Quote: "What sort of HUD do you think we'll be allowed to use this year?"

As it stands, there won't be any restrictions on your HUD whatsoever this year. You can use any media you'd like, displayed in any format, so long as the game retains its text adventure genre status . I wanted to make the rules as open as possible this year and so far no one seems to be protesting, hehe. We'll be judging the games mostly by writing ability and story quality, with the technical grade affecting your overall score as well... so, the more sophisticated the HUD/ GUI, the better you might score (not considering the media of course).

Quote: "How long should the game be?"

It's up to you really. The judges will play the game as thoroughly as they can... if there are a lot of entries, they may not finish it if it's long, so try to get some of your best features and content in as early as possible. But yeah, there isn't really a set length. More content = higher score of course... there's no such thing as too much conten .

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2024-11-20 08:38:07
Your offset time is: 2024-11-20 08:38:07