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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Do you think my game is worth 10USD?

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MrValentine
AGK Backer
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Playing: FFVII
Posted: 26th Nov 2011 18:59 Edited at: 26th Nov 2011 19:09
Slayer... its 4 CPU' actually... try to think why... but nice rig ... what OS though? And what bit...

EDIT

Judging by the spec I suspect it is a laptop...

CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 19:20
FPSC doesn't produce commercial-quality games.

I abandoned it for three years, and still, noone can bring me an example of shining epitome of modern gaming that doesn't end with "...for an FPSC game."

Slayer267
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 19:51
Yeah its a laptop... 9 fricking pounds...

FPSC Can produce commercial games! I know it can!

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Slow Programmer
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 19:55
If you have to have arguments about a game engine being professional grade or not, then it is not.

There are two kinds of computer users. Those that use Macs and those that wish they did.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 20:16 Edited at: 26th Nov 2011 20:16
I think FPSC if used right can cater well to a smaller commercial market, what we typically call the 'indie' game market. I wouldn't say it has AAA value and yes there are better quality engines out there. FPSC has its issues, but that doesn't limit a skilled user from creating good games that are commercially viable. Because all commercial viable means is "we can make money from it", of course I would for the sake of argument draw the line at it being something will pay money for and enjoy. I mean for low priced games I'd take a punt, but that doesn't mean what I've paid for is any good.

Of course, I wouldn't go as far as saying FPSC is professional grade, it isn't.

And you don't have to like it or how its games are formatted as a result of how FPSC works, regardless of how talented you are, your game will have an FPSC feel, which might be to the dislike of others. Like our Vietcong busting road-kill munching friend.


So all in all, I wouldn't price a FPSC game very high, unless of course it's exceptional. I'd probably pay the same as I would an app on my iPod Touch...I've only paid £10 for anything exceptional on there, but on average I'd say I pay £1.99.

old_School
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 20:44 Edited at: 26th Nov 2011 20:46
Hundreds of FPSc games have gone commerical. It is not something that is super hard to do using the engine. It requires skill and good programing skills. Ironically this is the same thing required to produce any commerical grade software. FPSC is useful if in the right hands. Most of you are starting out and have little or no programing skills. That is fine, infact TGC products are typicaly designed for you. However, some of you are not making the connection I dont think. A engine is a platform for you to learn from.

Think of FPSC as your base game code. Next add in your own variables etc to make the game fit your concept/needs. Next test of course for bugs errors and contenue. You will repeat this process several times before your software is completed. The engine just saves you a lot of time building basic variables and common variables most games FPS style allready have or should have built in. Again FPSC is a platform not a completed solution. Its up to you to decide how to complete the solution.

It's unwise to bash or disreguard something as un-useful you do not fully grasp or understand. Like any engine, its a tool that is designed to educate you and save you time. think of FPSC as a hammer and your using it to build a house. Hit the nail with it wrong and the nail will break. Hit the nails dead on and they will hold the house up tightly. so use the tool correctly and it works. Use the tool incorrectly and it will not hold your house up.
gendestroier
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 20:55
i can't belive these people are trying to compare a independent game made with the fpsc to the new modern games of today, wich some can get to cost millions, people this isn't even a fair comparation, the core teams of the modern games you're talking about are not just mere programers some of them are masters, so just stop trying to mach thnigs from different levels, you guys tryied it before in other threads, it didn't work, and now they want to repeat the same crap here, ohh god !

hey grunt !! let me see what you got first ! okay !? you said you migrated to udk, did you ever managed to acomplish more than wolf even with udk ? all by yourself ? i got to admit you've got some nerves at that time, but what've you acomplished so far, it's been a while you got to have something right ?

well on topic, i say i would by slayer's game for a dollar

mods for creating a inteligent game,at least
BlackFox
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 20:58
Quote: "think of FPSC as a hammer and your using it to build a house. Hit the nail with it wrong and the nail will break. Hit the nails dead on and they will hold the house up tightly."


We use a compressor and nail gun. Speeds up the process


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gendestroier
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 20:59
Quote: "We use a compressor and nail gun. Speeds up the process"

and in this analogy, what would they be ?

mods for creating a inteligent game,at least
BlackFox
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 21:07
Quote: "and in this analogy, what would they be ?"


They would be a joke. A bit of humor to lighten the mood. I don't need to compare any engine. We work with FPSC, UDK, Unity, Dark Basic Pro, and Game Maker. We like them all and have been very successful with each of them. We've sold many project developments to schools and other private clients in the last couple of years.

I do agree that the engine is a valuable tool to help you shape and structure your ideas, but the tool is only as good as the developer. Knowing the tools available is key, and being able to put your ideas and story plot together will fit only once that understanding takes hold. Looking at creative ideas to implement, and working to see if they actually will work gives a great sense of accomplishment. Then it is up to the developer to market and sell their product.


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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 21:14
Quote: "i can't belive these people are trying to compare a independent game made with the fpsc to the new modern games of today, wich some can get to cost millions, people this isn't even a fair comparation"


Exactly, so why say "FPSC is commercial quality?"

I'm not saying FPSC is bad, just that it isn't even intended to be in that kinda league.

Quote: "hey grunt !! let me see what you got first ! okay !? you said you migrated to udk, did you ever managed to acomplish more than wolf even with udk ? all by yourself ? i got to admit you've got some nerves at that time, but what've you acomplished so far, it's been a while you got to have something right ?"


I left game design altogether. I now write short stories.

I always got into game design to tell stories, but they need more than one man to make them. This way, I can tell stories without needing the help of others.

I did, however, get a tonne done in UDK. Custom AI, vehicles. Various stuff like a Warthog-type jeep with two seats. The driver had a small markerlight turret that could be used for spotting targets for the gunner, in the side seat. Gunner had control of the rear minigun for taking out said targets.

Then I had a few gunship variants. A light attack gunship with a forward chin gun that had a steady round-a-second rate of fire for taking out other vehicles, plus a pair of homing missile launchers for the same effect. I almost managed to get side seats to work, so the single pilot could escort two teammates, either to augment firepower, or drop and pick them up if needs be.

Other gunship was a heavier variant, single occupant. Primary was a pair of miniguns, secondary racked up a salvo of eight missiles, non-homing, that could be unleashed on ground and air targets to obliterate defenses. I was working on an underbelly turret that would seek my Homing Missile class and shoot down anyway incoming to the vehicle, but there was issues with coding the missiles to fall out of the sky rather than explode.

Plus various turret designs. Emplaced and immobile, I had homing missiles, focused lasers for accurate anti-air takedowns, especially en masse. Mortar turrets modelled on the Halo Wraith. Minigun turrets, flamethrower turrets, Anti-Air burst fire Flak turrrets. Turrets were a great way to learn more complex weapon programming.

Got a custom pawn sorted, but the animations were a little clunky. Custom weapons had similar problems, so my plan was to make a vehicular FPS, with very few personnel weapons. Stuff like man-portable homing missile launchers were a given, plus various other weapon types, and my personal favourite, the TITR.

Basically a plasma rifle that the player could control the finesse of the magnetic field. Ratchet it to the max, and it becomes a perfectly accurate, kills-on-headshot sniper rifle. Then in had semi-auto mode, full-auto, and flamethrower. Each decreased range, power and accuracy in favour of rate of fire and power consumption. I managed to get the auto charging system done, as well as each version. However I had issues with programming the ability to dynamically change it after the player made their first setting.

I did all that in a year of UDK, way more than I ever achieved in several years of FPSC.

gendestroier
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 21:25 Edited at: 26th Nov 2011 21:37
Quote: "We work with FPSC, UDK, Unity, Dark Basic Pro, and Game Maker. We like them all and have been very successful with each of them. We've sold many project developments to schools and other private clients in the last couple of years. "


well this is very good congratz

Quote: "
I do agree that the engine is a valuable tool to help you shape and structure your ideas, but the tool is only as good as the developer. Knowing the tools available is key, and being able to put your ideas and story plot together will fit only once that understanding takes hold. Looking at creative ideas to implement, and working to see if they actually will work gives a great sense of accomplishment. Then it is up to the developer to market and sell their product."


couldn't put it better myself, i just hope it ends this discussion, we've benn over and over with this, it's starting to get old.


sounds good grunt ! somehow your comment made me think in how weird is to have an editor with nodirect acess to the dbpr codebase as it has in udk, and also, why didn't lee migrated fpsc to c++ while it was yet easy (easy compared to now)

Quote: "Exactly, so why say "FPSC is commercial quality?""


my god ! man comercial quality at your way is only possible to be done by big companies ! it's not the only way to make a comercial game, this is what i'm trying to make you undertand all along ! you get it now ?

mods for creating a inteligent game,at least
CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 21:46
Quote: "my god ! man comercial quality at your way is only possible to be done by big companies ! it's not the only way to make a comercial game, this is what i'm trying to make you undertand all along ! you get it now ?"




It's hard to understand when your sentence is so garbled. My point is that you were claiming FPSC can do commercial quality, when it can't. Now that we've agreed it can't do commercial quality...can we please move on?

gendestroier
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 21:51 Edited at: 26th Nov 2011 21:59
Quote: "can we please move on?"


okay.. now to avoid further comfusion, let's just call it non-comercial, comercial and indstrial level, is this better ?

and we move on to were in this topic ? you got any ideas ?

Quote: "garbled"


humm sorry about that, i'm using a wireless keyboard, a crapy one with use to run out of battery quick

mods for creating a inteligent game,at least
Agent Dink
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 22:05
You can make a commercial game (meaning you can sell it) out of anything. This does not mean it will sell or that it is of good quality. I could take dump and try to sell it online. That doesn't mean anyone wants it, but it's a commercial product, right? I can sell anything I want, but commercial does not imply good quality. Just buy furniture from WalMart and you'll see what I mean.

Can you make a high quality game in FPSC? Yes, I believe you can, but can you make a game in FPSC that compares to Modern Warfare 3 or Battlefield 3? Simply no. Don't even try. You're wasting your time. You're better off starting from scratch. FPSC was not intended for projects like that. FPSC is good for something along the lines of Doom or Quake with modernized graphics. I wouldn't push it beyond that.

FPSC has it's place, but in no way can it be compared to UDK. That is completely ignorant.

http://lossofanonymity.wordpress.com
CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 22:36
I know, I couldn't use UDK if I hadn't used FPSC beforehand. FPSC is great for starting out, learning the ropes.

The only problem is relearning when moving to a new engine. FPSC is, or was, so rigid. UDK is far more flexible, giving you just enough rope to hang yourself, if you're not careful.

gendestroier
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 23:17
Quote: "FPSC is, or was, so rigid"


indeed, and now that isn't so rigid, it's unstable, well... kind of.

mods for creating a inteligent game,at least
Slayer267
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Posted: 26th Nov 2011 23:58
I am being killed with

"The game wont finish loading" from giving out my demo...

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swissolo
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 00:31
Quote: "I always got into game design to tell stories, but they need more than one man to make them"

Really? At least that all answers my question as to how you got on to these forums

swis
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yohan12
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 01:15
Quote: "wondering if you guys think this is worth 10 USD"

In my opinion, No.

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Eminent
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 01:29
Quote: "Alot of games like MW3 use a crap load of polygons."


*facepalm*
Slayer267
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 01:32
Quote: "*facepalm* "


Speechless... (Forgot they use a better engine...)

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old_School
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 03:39
I think they use Valve engin. Its only 50k per lic to use it. I say only because one your software is made using it, you can make hundreds of millions in profit after. So for the price, valve worth the pricetag, just like everything else in life. You get what you pay for, commercial engines are not cheap.
KeithC
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 04:21
Quote: "My point is that you were claiming FPSC can do commercial quality, when it can't."


Again; and it's just been shown...it can. The issue here (with your opinion) isn't whether FPSC can do a commercial quality game; it's whether a commercial quality game has to sell X number of dollars to qualify as a commercial game. If you sell 10 copies of an FPSC game for $5 each, you've made a commercial game...because it sold for money.

-Keith

Slow Programmer
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 04:43
Quote: "Quote: "My point is that you were claiming FPSC can do commercial quality, when it can't."

Again; and it's just been shown...it can. The issue here (with your opinion) isn't whether FPSC can do a commercial quality game; it's whether a commercial quality game has to sell X number of dollars to qualify as a commercial game. If you sell 10 copies of an FPSC game for $5 each, you've made a commercial game...because it sold for money.
"


My opinion only to follow

No that is a hobby not a commercial business or product. Did you collect sales tax? Are you subject to reporting the sales on your income tax? This is no different than my neighbor doing woodworking projects in his garage and selling a table at a yard-sale every so often. He has a hobby not a business.

There are two kinds of computer users. Those that use Macs and those that wish they did.
KeithC
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 05:05 Edited at: 27th Nov 2011 05:06
Alright; let's go with that then. What is the line? $500, $1000....

I buy things from TGC all the time without paying any tax; are they not commercial? Is a freelancer doing a small project for a client considered a hobbyist? What's the threshold from hobbyist, to commercially viable?

-Keith

BlackFox
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 05:28
Quote: "What's the threshold from hobbyist, to commercially viable?"


When Blueberry muffins are involved.


Twitter: @NFoxMedia
Quik
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 05:43
Quote: "No that is a hobby not a commercial business or product. Did you collect sales tax? Are you subject to reporting the sales on your income tax? This is no different than my neighbor doing woodworking projects in his garage and selling a table at a yard-sale every so often. He has a hobby not a business.
"


oh so you basicly mean i can sell my 3ds max models, even though iam using th estundent uncommercial verson?
awesome.


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
Slayer267
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 05:52
No. Because you do not have the legal permission to do that...

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Quik
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 06:04
but he said it wasnt commercially if i sell a couple of them for 5$?


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Slayer267
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 06:08
If you sell something that means its commercial. That's that. If your going to Bleep and complain then you might as well get off these forums because we don't like people who make this thread 2 pages longer due to arguments. That's that!

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Quik
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 06:26
you do realize that i was not serious, but rather questioning Slow Programmers Logic in a half sarcastic manner right?

I do know what commercial means.


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
old_School
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 06:29
Quote: "sarcastic manner "


Not to be Mr. Obvious but this is the net, we can not hear you nor can we see your body language when you speak. Sarcasim is something spoken not written typicaly.It is very hard to write something sarcasticly and everyone catch it over the net.
Slayer267
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 06:31
... You made 3 pages of your stuff... Not acceptable if its a joke... -.-

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Quik
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 06:32
offcourse it is, point was however that as soon as i sell something, its a commercial product, as iam making money out of it.
Wether its a few copies or a lot is irrelevant.


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Slayer267
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 07:02
exactally...

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old_School
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 07:17
Just my thoughts but I think we should close this topic. It's turning into a circus with silly posts. Just my observation.
Slayer267
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 07:42
Anyways. I am redoing all of the multiplayer maps for my game... But the least TGC can do is fix this waiting to join thing...

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KeithC
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Posted: 27th Nov 2011 07:52 Edited at: 27th Nov 2011 07:53
This is turning into another circular argument about the viability of FPSC, in creating a "commercial" game title. This has been brought up time and time again. I suggest Slayer actually complete a/the game first; then get all the marketing done, including a viable demo...then present it to the masses. It is at that point that you will find out if people will buy your game for "X" number of dollars. Anything else is just speculation.

The "this engine is better/more commercial than that engine" argument is getting quite old. Use what you think works for your project....period.

-Keith

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