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Geek Culture / Sony--- just shameless

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Raven
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 07:12
:shrugs: it's the figure Apple had on their keynote.
I wouldn't be surprised tbh

Think about how many people accidentally break their phones.
I've had about 5 handsets in the last 2years myself, and I'm damn careful with them. (2 were stolen, one was accidentally washed with the clothes and I current have 2 handsets)

A mate of mine generally kills off 2-3 a month, usually after a night out.. either looses it, or drops is down the stairs, etc.
So he certainly pads out that adverage.

Probably isn't quite as high as Apple made out, but it's certainly a ridiculously huge market.

Chris K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 10:23
Ha!!!

I liked Raven's first line actually... as if they were actually arguing about sandwiches.

In other news:

The winning country in the Where The Hell Are We Going To Regain Our Losses Competition is....... ThE UNiTeD KIIIIIIINGdomMmmm!!!!!

Yes! Wow! Really? Us again? God I just feel so proud.

A PS3 is worth $840 right? Right??

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Chris K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 10:31 Edited at: 25th Jan 2007 10:32
Whoa whoa whoa whoa.

I didn't realise Raven was actually sticking to that!

So every person in Africa buys SEVENTEEN phones A YEAR?!?!?.

So, some 6 year old third world child, has purchased in his life, 100 mobile phones?? So has his brothers and sisters??

I think now you have actually become a parody of a parody of yourself.

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Kentaree
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 10:42
PS3 release details: GBP 425/Eur599. Which is equivalent to 836.590 USD and 777.117 USD. How much was the thing in the US again? Ever so slight rip off methinks

Chris K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 11:06 Edited at: 25th Jan 2007 11:27
I actually take that back!

Sweden has to pay the equivalent of $900!!

----

He he

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Benjamin
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 11:36
Are you feeling alright Chris?

Tempest - P2P UDP Multiplayer Plugin (DBP/DBCe)
Download the free version
Chris K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 11:39
What?! Hey?!! Who's talking to me?!

Yay! Look at me!!

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Crazy Ninja
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 13:18
Chris come back to us! Don't fall under the spell of doom... NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! HELP ME!!!

Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 15:21
Quote: "Less profits mean less people want to invest, because they're either not going to make much back or they're going to loose money in share resale."


I wish this were true, since then my stocks would be doing better. Actually now adays people have tossed the PE ratio right out the window and look more at growth potential of a company. Heck a few years back Amazon was trading like mad, climbing and climbing even though they had never turned a profit. Their stock price was roughly 50x their actual value, they paid no dividends, and reported losses of around .13 a share to 1.25 a share every quarter. Other stocks would report earnings around $3 a share, pay a decent dividend, be a solid company all around and people do not invest because the growth potential is so low This is because many people now treat the stock market like a trip to Foxwoods, "Put it all on stock x, I'll cash out in an hour", instead of a long term investment.

NeX the Fairly Fast Ferret
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 17:13
Might be the old UK/USA billion again.


Since the other one was scaring you guys so much...
Fallout
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 17:27
Quote: "Might be the old UK/USA billion again"


That was 1000 times bigger than the current billion.


Chris K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 17:44
This is like the time Raven claimed a car factory had laid off 600,000 workers - and then actually stuck to it.

Whyyy? He could have just made up that it was a typo!

But no, Apple said it. Yes Apple said it, Raven. Good point.

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Izzy545
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 18:49 Edited at: 25th Jan 2007 18:52
Why are you still bashing Raven like 11 posts after he posted, even though you've already bashed him in like 5 of those 11 posts? I think you need to lay off just a bit Chris, a little over zealous are we?

Chris K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 19:13
If by 5, you mean 1, then you are right.

And I can't stand people who lie, it is pathetic.

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
Izzy545
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 19:25
Quote: "Ha!!!

I liked Raven's first line actually... as if they were actually arguing about sandwiches."

Quote: "
This is like the time Raven claimed a car factory had laid off 600,000 workers - and then actually stuck to it.

Whyyy? He could have just made up that it was a typo!

But no, Apple said it. Yes Apple said it, Raven. Good point."


Quote: "Whoa whoa whoa whoa.

I didn't realise Raven was actually sticking to that!

So every person in Africa buys SEVENTEEN phones A YEAR?!?!?.

So, some 6 year old third world child, has purchased in his life, 100 mobile phones?? So has his brothers and sisters??

I think now you have actually become a parody of a parody of yourself."


Yup, only once

And I agree he's misinformed at best, but I see no need for the constant attacks.

Jeku
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 20:12
I can see *maybe* 100 billion phones were made since the invention of the phone--- *maybe*.

But other than that, I've noticed upon visiting many big and small game blogs, many of them get games sent to them for free from Nintendo, etc. At least I *assume* they're free as they get them before they're available at retail. Any ideas on this?

Matt Rock
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Posted: 25th Jan 2007 22:02
They get press kits. Usually a kit would include an "extended demo" (which is basically the entire game, although sometimes it might be missing a level or two), a post-dev design document, and sometimes they have knick-knacks and stuff, like posters and whatnot. At least that's what magazines get, I'm not sure about blogs. The campus paper in college would occasionally get press kits from distributors so we'd review their games, and we were a puny little paper, so I assume blogs and websites get those as well.


"In an interstellar burst, I'm back to save the universe"
Jeku
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Posted: 26th Jan 2007 00:47
More shameless Sony news!

They used a PGR3 shot from the Xbox 360 to advertise Gran Turismo PSP on Sony's PSP Connect site. Why? Who knows!

Link here

Even if this was done on purpose (which I'm not saying it was), why?

Zappo
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Posted: 26th Jan 2007 01:26
Mmmm. Its not there now. The screenshot was apparently from the press pack for PGR3. The original banner they say was there isn't actually very well produced, especially as there isn't a game called GT4HD (its either GT4 or GTHD) so if it really was live on the site it was probably just a place holder.
Jeku
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Posted: 26th Jan 2007 01:40
But don't they do a quick sanity check over their work before submitting it?

I mean, last week Sony had a game on their site where the description was talking about how well the Wii controls work for it. It's like they copy and pasted the info from a non-biased site and placed it without reading it through first.

Kevin Picone
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Jeku
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Posted: 27th Jan 2007 10:33
Sony 'gagging' developer's opinions. Hmmm--- have they got something to hide?

Hobgoblin Lord
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Posted: 27th Jan 2007 15:04
"How do you feel today Developer 196?"

"I am very excited..."

"As am I. All hail Big Brother SONY."

What kind of moronic crap is that! You can only say you are very excited about the launch. Day by day my opinion of SONY is falling, I never wished them ill or anything, but now I hope they fall dead flat and all the PS3's out there become paperweights when developers give SONY the middle finger and stop developing for them at all.

Antidote
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Posted: 27th Jan 2007 15:24
And then you have the PSP

yeah


Zappo
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Posted: 27th Jan 2007 22:59
Kevin Picone: Good story there. Possibly the most factual linked story posted in this thread.
Quote: "Sony 'gagging' developer's opinions. Hmmm--- have they got something to hide?"

Perhaps it was to try and stop all the baseless price guesses and fake release dates which got pasted from blogs to sites to blogs etc. all over the Web? Maybe it was to stop developers who made special deals with MS or Nintendo slagging off PS3 versions of games because they couldn't be arsed to add the extra features it can provide? Perhaps Sony just wanted to release the details of the console themselves without having someone leak incomplete or preliminary information? Maybe its not a big conspiracy and maybe the 'band wagon' should hold off on its recruitment drive so people can make their own minds up? Just a thought.
Jeku
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Posted: 27th Jan 2007 23:51
Um, it has nothing to do with leaking information. And hello, the PS3 is already out so there's nothing to leak. The game publishers have their rights to announce ship dates, etc., so it has *nothing* to do with that, and if you read the article you'd know.

Basically if you're a PS3 developer you are legally unable to say anything about it. This is obviously due to all the negative press going around from developers who complain the PS3 hardware is incredibly difficult to develop for.

Zappo
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 00:31
Mmmm. Jeku, if you read the article you would see it concerns SCEE (as in Sony Computer Entertainment Europe) and the PS3 is NOT OUT in Europe yet.
Quote: "This is obviously due to all the negative press going around from developers"
<Yawn>More speculation. There's lots of that around here.
Steve J
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 00:48
@Zappo: It just so happens that Jeku works at EA. Possibly he actually knows something you dont, or wait your the only one right! Of course it HAS to be speculation, because you know everything about it all, and know it isnt right...

Jeku
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 00:59 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 01:02
Quote: "the PS3 is NOT OUT in Europe yet"


Tell me something I don't know. The PS3 hardware is virtually the same in Europe as it is here in NA. Sony announced the release date for Europe. So no, it's not speculation, but logic. There's a time and a place to be a fanboy, but when you defend something for the sake of defending, even when the evidence is piling up for the other side, then it's really just sad.

Let's pretend that you're right, and Sony is gagging developers about--- erm--- PS3 release dates. What do you say about all the developers who previously came out and had negative things to say about the hardware? Just speculation? This is deja-vous all over again from when the PS2 was released and developers were having a difficult time. It's nothing new, so merely playing devil's advocate is not helping your cause.

Quote: "Maybe it was to stop developers who made special deals with MS or Nintendo slagging off PS3 versions of games because they couldn't be arsed to add the extra features it can provide?"


Care to go into detail about these extra features the PS3 can provide? Honestly, I'm interested.

Quote: "Possibly he actually knows something you dont, or wait your the only one right! "


I admit I do not work on any PS3 games at the moment, so honestly I don't know anything about it that anyone else doesn't.

Zappo
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 01:13
Quote: "@Zappo: It just so happens that Jeku works at EA. Possibly he actually knows something you dont, or wait your the only one right! Of course it HAS to be speculation, because you know everything about it all, and know it isnt right..."

Haaaaa! Brilliant. Jeku posts a link to a story he hasn't read and I must be wrong?! <Sarcasm>What a wonderfully well thought out and productive responce, Steve J. Perhaps Jeku could get you that dream job you want at EA if you suck up enough? Maybe the real reason Sony added the NDA to their developer agreements was because the PS3 is actually a Wii/Xbox360 hybrid because they never ever have any original ideas or develop any new technologies.</Sarcasm>

Forgive my annoyed tone, but I urge everyone to research these things before posting. Look into it and make up your own mind rather than relying on biased opinions from people who own one system or another, or work for one company or another. Heaven knows there are enough sites and blogs around that twist and distort anything Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo do. Instead of reading conspiracy theories in everything, look at the facts, look at the figures and decide for yourself.
Tinkergirl
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 01:22
Quote: "I admit I do not work on any PS3 games at the moment, so honestly I don't know anything about it that anyone else doesn't."


I know more, but I probably can't say.

In other, completely unrelated news, I love playing the Wii and occasionally I even consider buying a 360! Don't want a PS3 though - personal preference, of course, and nothing to do with what coders at work say.

Steve J
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 01:27
bwahah, why would I want to work in a game dev job? I would rather be scripting sites, and using php. Game dev is a hobby, not much else.

I owned 2 systems (PS3 and 360), before I sold off my PS3 when it was still worth about $500. I have played the wii, kind of owned it (borrowed it from a friend). The wii has crap graphics, but it IS fun, and I got to play a game with my gf, first time she has ever looked at consoles as fun. The 360 has the whole multiplayer fun factor with good graphics. The PS3 has good graphics, but it wasnt THAT fun, and its network only had lots of people on a few games.

And I did decide for myself. I was saying that it is possible that Jeku DID know something. Thats just me though.

Zappo
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 01:30 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 02:16
Quote: "There's a time and a place to be a fanboy, but when you defend something for the sake of defending, even when the evidence is piling up for the other side, then it's really just sad."

Oh, I am not a fan boy. I could turn your sentence around completely and point out that you and several others seem to be attacking Sony purely because you are Nintendo or MS fanboys. The evidence that people seem to be 'piling up' seems to be speculation and personal opinions. Thats not evidence. People just seem desperate to slag off the PS3 and so copy and paste garbage from all over the net without actually reading it or looking for the facts. That is sad and lazy.
Quote: "What do you say about all the developers who previously came out and had negative things to say about the hardware?"
I say 'fare enough'. Its new hardware with new features - of course its different to what they are used to and will probably take time to take advantage of its potential. Like you say, it was the same when the PS2 came out and where does sit in the home console sales chart?
Quote: "Care to go into detail about these extra features the PS3 can provide?"
As an example, it's been widely reported by the 'none biased' that the PS3 games are capable of better graphics than the 360 and the Wii. Its also been widely reported that companies working on games which are on several platforms are not taking advantage of these capabilities because its too much extra work. Do a Google search if you don't believe me.
Jeku
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 03:39
Quote: "I urge everyone to research these things before posting."


Funny, I was just going to tell you to do the same thing. You haven't given any evidence, as you're just telling us to "do the research" and not listen to speculation.

Quote: "People just seem desperate to slag off the PS3 and so copy and paste garbage from all over the net without actually reading it or looking for the facts"


But you haven't said any facts! What are you trying to tell us? You've come in this thread and told us that we are slagging off the PS3, and how it makes angels cry. But what exactly are these facts that we're not "researching"?

I *SAW* the mistake on Sony's site myself, the one where they praise the Wii version of a game that was on all three systems, so I reported it. Is that research enough for you? I'm telling you I see these things with my own eyes. I have friends who own PS3s--- I played one of the PS3s at work, and checked out their "must-have" titles, which so far is Resistance. Been there, done that, bought the T-Shirt, thought the game was not fun and I can list a dozen reasons why.

Quote: "and where does sit in the home console sales chart?"


The PS2 was flying off the shelves so fast when it was released, so it's just a tad bit different now. With my "researching" skills I have seen with my own eyes PS3s being sold at a discount. But I forgot, I haven't done enough "research" to believe my own eyes hehe.

Quote: "it's been widely reported by the 'none biased' that the PS3 games are capable of better graphics than the 360 and the Wii."


Point taken... capable *maybe*. Put in practice? Definitely not. I'll wait until the PS3 has a game that is more gorgeous than Viva Pinata or Gears of War before we discuss graphics. Funny how you say "widely reported"--- was this info taken from the net? Taking your own advice on research are we?

Quote: "Its also been widely reported that companies working on games which are on several platforms are not taking advantage of these capabilities because its too much extra work."


Yah, and I was the first to report that in this thread. Funny how that works eh? The 3DO was miles ahead of the competition at the time--- the hardware kicked ass basically, but it died because of its high-priced retail tag ($700). That, and the PlayStation was just released and Sony was a more well-known brand. It's not only hardware that makes or breaks a machine. Hell, many Dreamcast games looked quite a bit better than their PS2 counterparts--- where is the Dreamcast now?

And if you did your research you would discover that the PS3 hardware is *NOT* more powerful than a 360s.

Zappo
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 04:37
Quote: "You haven't given any evidence, as you're just telling us to "do the research" and not listen to speculation."
Exactly my point! Don't just listen to peoples opinions in this thread... my advice is to go and look for yourselves. Don't take it personally Jeku, I aimed it at everyone!
Quote: "But you haven't said any facts! What are you trying to tell us?"
I am trying to tell you that most of the comments in this thread are without factual basis. I have already pointed out several holes in the comments made and pointed to places which back this up. I am not just saying 'this is great, that is crap' which seems to be a recurring theme here.
Quote: "I *SAW* the mistake on Sony's site myself, the one where they praise the Wii version of a game that was on all three systems, so I reported it."
Okay. I didn't disagree with that, but has there never been mistakes made on other companies Web sites? Should we all refuse to buy PS3's and recommend others do the same because of a mistake made in the description of a game? A little harsh don't you think?
Quote: "I played one of the PS3s at work, and checked out their "must-have" titles, which so far is Resistance. Been there, done that, bought the T-Shirt, thought the game was not fun and I can list a dozen reasons why."
So you played one game on a system which hasn't even had a World Wide release yet, and you write off the console? Again, a bit harsh don't you think?
Quote: "The PS2 was flying off the shelves so fast when it was released, so it's just a tad bit different now."
I wasn't refering to sales, I was refering to people saying it was difficult to write for when it first came out - as were you.
Quote: "Funny how you say "widely reported"--- was this info taken from the net? Taking your own advice on research are we?"
Indeed. Doing my own research and not relying on second hand interpretted postings.
Quote: "Yah, and I was the first to report that in this thread. Funny how that works eh?"
And yet you needed to ask me for details. Odd.
Quote: "The 3DO was miles ahead of the competition at the time--- the hardware kicked ass basically, but it died because of its high-priced retail tag ($700)."
This was the main reason but there were other reasons too. For example, in the UK Panasonic had a deal where only they could supply their 3DO for quite some time after its initial release. By the time other manufacturers released their versions the market just wasn't there anymore. Plus there were differences between manufacturers versions which goes against the idea of a standardised console. (Road Rash on it was awesome by the way).
Quote: "And if you did your research you would discover that the PS3 hardware is *NOT* more powerful than a 360s."
Which bit of hardware are you refering to? The graphics hardware (which you have already admitted is capable of beating the others)? The built-in optical drive hardware? The hardware inside the controlers? The floating point performance? The networking hardware? I don't want to get into another CPU performance comparison, and I am sure you can come up with things which you think the XBox360 is better at, but I am sure you can see that its down to what you want to do with the hardware. Your sweeping generalization saying the PS3's hardware is not as powerful as the 360 is just seeking arguments.
Jeku
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 07:57 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 08:01
Quote: "I have already pointed out several holes in the comments made and pointed to places which back this up."


Hmmm-- can't find that anywhere in this thread is what my point is

Quote: "Should we all refuse to buy PS3's and recommend others do the same because of a mistake made in the description of a game?"


Where did I recommend to others not to buy a PS3? I'm not buying one because there aren't games available for it-- fact. All this BS Sony is pulling behind the scenes is just irritating and shameless, which is why I created this thread in the first place. Do you think everything that's been announced in this thread is just heresay and non-factual, biased, etc.? If they're true, then they're true! Please point me to the articles with which you have linked to which say none of it is true.

Quote: "So you played one game on a system which hasn't even had a World Wide release yet, and you write off the console? Again, a bit harsh don't you think?"


Uh, yah, because according to the major game blogs Resistance is the "must-have" title for PS3. Of course I'm going to play it! Can you let me know of any games that are out right now for PS3 that I should try instead? We have over 30,000 games in the library at work that I can open up and play on any console, so I promise you I'll play this 'killer game' that I'm missing out on at lunch on Monday. You just have to let me know which one it is first, okay?

And what does it matter if it's been released world wide? It's going to be the same system in Europe--- you *DO* know that right?

Quote: "Indeed. Doing my own research and not relying on second hand interpretted postings."


Okay *noww* I understand. My sources are second hand interpreted postings, but your sources are legitimately backed up and notarized by Harvard lawyers. Got it.

Quote: "And yet you needed to ask me for details. Odd."


Are you in the right thread? I asked you for details on what exactly the PS3 features are that the 360 doesn't have, and all you said was the graphics are capable of being better. Wow. I didn't ask you to tell me what I already posted in this thread.

And did you read the line where I said the PS3 hardware is not more powerful than the 360 hardware? If not, please do.

Quote: "Road Rash on it was awesome by the way"


I know-- it's the only reason I still have my 3DO kicking around

Quote: "Your sweeping generalization saying the PS3's hardware is not as powerful as the 360 is just seeking arguments."


I guess I'll just have to wait for your arguments, then. I only know what I have read, and I assume you the same. Oblivion was stored *twice* on the Blu-Ray disc because of the drive's slow access times. Care to comment, or are you convinced larger capacity discs = better games?

Quote: "The graphics hardware (which you have already admitted is capable of beating the others)?"


Uh, wha--? Where? Are you referring to when I said "capable maybe"? I said that because it depends on many things, including whether the developers will even use the power. If you want to get in an argument over whether the PS3 can do "better" graphics, then let me know once a pretty game is released on the PS3

Quote: "The built-in optical drive hardware? The hardware inside the controlers? The floating point performance? The networking hardware?"


Alright, since you brought it up, list out how each of those are superior to the 360s with your top secret sources then get back to me.

I am not a fanboy ok? I'm developing on a PSP at work all day, so believe me I couldn't care less about brand name. All I initially created this thread for was to outline shameless Sony tactics that they've been smearing on our faces for decades. Remember that so-called in-game Killzone 2 and Moto Racer footage they showed us at E3? That is what started it for me.

I'm a puzzle and adventure game fanboy, and I like money, so if the PS3 comes out with interesting games that appeal to me and my wallet, I'll gladly pick it up. What I don't understand is how people like yourself can defend a brand until your dying day as if you're defending your own grandmother.

Chris K
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 12:11
Where are these games that run better/look better on PS3?

The best thing about all these 'exclusives' jumping to 360 is it proves conclusively that the systems are identical.

Doesn't anyone remember when Stranglehold was 'demomstrating the power of Cell'? And the 360 *port* looks identical. These are games that were originally developed solely for PS3, and were then put on 360.

Oh and what's this? Square have just licensed UE3 for all their upcoming games?! Can anyone say 'multiplatform'?

-= Out here in the fields, I fight for my meals =-
David R
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 12:34 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 12:37
Zappo == Fanboy.

I think that pretty much sums that up

EDIT:
Quote: "but I am sure you can see that its down to what you want to do with the hardware. Your sweeping generalization saying the PS3's hardware is not as powerful as the 360 is just seeking arguments."


Logically, you'd base the 'performance' or 'power' of a unit by the sum of its parts. So what Jeku (and others) are saying is

Sum of PS3 Hardware < Sum of XBox 360 Hardware


"History shall be kind to me, for I intend to write it" - Winston Churchill
Benjamin
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 12:42
Quote: "Zappo == Fanboy."

Not really. Rather it seems to me that everyone here is anti-Sony.

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Chris K
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 14:15
No, everyone is basically saying they are identical (as a machine - not in terms of games or cost or controllers or optical drives), Zappo is maintaining that the PS3 is better which is a complete lie. If you put a 360 inards in a PS3 case, (and vica versa), you would not be able to tell them apart.

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Chris K
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 14:17
Asise from the Bluray thing of course.

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Matt Rock
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 17:18 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 17:18
Have you looked at the PS3's technical stats compared to the 360? I'm pretty sure you could tell them apart . I hate how Zappo is flaming in support of Sony, it doesn't do my side of the debate any good, but I'd have to agree with him there. Complain about Sony's business practices and ethics, that's fine. Or the cost of the console, I won't argue. But to say the PS3 is inferior is flat-out silly. It's true that 360 graphics and PS3 graphics look relatively the same, but keep in mind that developers have had a full market year to play with and explore the potential of the 360. Developers have had less than half that time with PS3 dev kits, pre-market included. No one has really gone for broke on maximizing the potential of either the Wii or the PS3. I'm finding it very, very difficult to believe that anyone could honestly believe the PS3 is a crappy/ inferior console. When I hear things like that, I start to seriously think that Ben is 100% right.


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David R
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 17:19 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 17:19
Quote: "Have you looked at the PS3's technical stats compared to the PS3?"


?

EDIT: Ah, you changed it dammit!


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Matt Rock
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 17:28
yeah, caught myself typoing again lol. Compared against itself though, it's still a good machine hehe.


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David R
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 17:32
Meh, I just came across the following comparisons of power from IGN/Gamespy. These look pretty conclusive in my opinion, although I doubt their authenticity due to their lack of units - what the hell are some of these things measured in?










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Matt Rock
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 18:15
I've seen those figures before and for a short period of time I was starting to consider becoming an xbox fan, but then I heard from a number of people that they were basing those numbers on guesswork. It's funny... Game Informer's comparison of the two machines favors the PS3, Gamespy's favors the 360, and I haven't yet been able to find three websites that agree with each other on what the consoles are better/ worse at. But as I understand it (don't ask me why I have this written down, lol):

360: 3-core processor at 3.2GHz/ 1MB cache, 512MB GDDR3 RAM @ 700 MHz, ATI Xenos video chip @ 500 MHz (48 billion shader operations per second)

PS3: Cell processor at 3.2 GHz/ 1MB cache, 512MB XDRAM @ 400 MHz, NVidia RSX video chip @ 550 MHz (74.8 billion shader operations per second)

They're basically identical except for the 360's superior bus speed... but then there's the PS3's far superior video chip (and from what I've heard and read just about everywhere so far, the cell processor is a bad mother [shut yo' mouth!]), and that's why they're considered dead-even by some people, but seriously, in terms of graphics power, the PS3 obviously wins... we just need to wait a while for developers to get the hang of the overly complicated PS3 dev kit, and once that happens, we'll start seeing very impressive graphics out of the console.

Sorry for the "Shaft" quote, couldn't help myself.


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Kevin Picone
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 19:30
I'm not surprised developers are moaning about PS3's being an unfriendly programming environment, then again, so is the PC . Nor am I that surprised their not getting great results. If[i] the CELL works as radically different as has been suggested (ie. Here), then it's not going to a 'load & run' type deal.

[i]Sega
had a similar issue with the Saturn and it's dual cpu's. Developers moaned left, right & centre about how difficult it was to write optimal code for it. Which apparently resulted in a lot of the first/second generation titles barely using the second CPU. This certainly cost Sega at that time, so perhaps history is repeating itself.

Chris K
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 19:42
No, the PS3s graphics card is not superior.

Nobody said PS3 was inferior (you said everyone did, I don't know where you got that from), it is effectively identical.

It is harder to get the same performance out of the Cell than out of the 360's processor, but not massively (for experienced developers). If you want an example of this, look at Assassin's Creed, where they had to make the AI simpler so it would work on Cell. Again, this is a former PS3 exclusive - the 360 version has had *less time*.

But all this techno babble is unimportant, it simply boils down to Show Me The Game That Is Better On PS3.

It does not exist. 90% are exactly the same, a few run better on 360.

If FFXIII has gone to UE3, which has been suggested (The White Engine could not render in realtime last time I checked), then it will be coming to 360, sooner or later. Square are notoriously unloyal to platforms - they will go where the market is.

People will only start buying PS3s when there is significantly better software on it. This is what Sony promised, but unfortunately it is simply not going to happen. No chance they'll sell 10 million consoles in a year.

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Jeku
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 21:03
Quote: "Not really. Rather it seems to me that everyone here is anti-Sony."


I don't know how someone could come to that conclusion. It's not about Sony here, it's about shameless publicity stunts. Honestly, I would go the other way if Nintendo flat out said their hardware is more powerful than the PS3 or 360.

Quote: "But to say the PS3 is inferior is flat-out silly."


And this is why I really am worried about today's youth--- for the very last time, nobody would say the PS3 as a whole is inferior to the 360. I have *never* heard that, and I'd be awfully surprised if I did. The same should be said the other way, but unfortunately because the PS3 is brand new, there's this assumption that it must be faster. The majority of cost of the PS3 is on the blue laser for the optical drive--- which everyone knows is slow! For the record I didn't say the PS3 was inferior

And I know the bandwidth of the PS3 is very small compared to the 360, so even if it had a super computer in that little box, it would not be able to squeeze enough data through the pipe as fast as it should.

Ri karou
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Posted: 28th Jan 2007 21:04 Edited at: 28th Jan 2007 21:06
ok, sony's online thing (whatever its called) dosent even use headsets, so u basically play monotone all the time u play multiplayer, no rumble feature in the controller. and with all seriousness my friend uses the ps3 to message his feet while he plays 360 or the wii, because it rumbles so much.

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